Upgrading Engines

[Scott Allen Hill]

I just broke the crank shaft on my 302EFI engine and want to get more horsepower to increase my towing ability. I am either considering dropping a 351W in my '85 Bronco or rebuilding my 302 and increasing the horsepower to 250hp. However, I have spoken with several rebuilders and they are telling me that my main problem will be with the computer module and to make a significant increase to my horsepower will cost upwards of $6,000. ( That seems awfully expensive and was wondering if anyine has had a similar upgrade and what success they have had in this arena.

 

[89Bronco58]

first off 6 grand is bull....but i just blew my efi 302 and dropped a windsor in and now i have alot more torque and power...i had to change the computer over to an efi 351 computer and do a little exhaust work cuz the 351w is wider and pulls the xhaust apart and up....but other than that the wiring harness is the same except 351w dont have nock sensors so youd have an extra plug not going anywhere.....also if u do this u need to get 351w exhaust manifolds cuz the egr runs directly into the exhaust manifold rather than into the intake as a 302 does...

 

[BLADE262US]

All true except the wiring harnesses are different The reason they will work is that the speed density system uses whats called bank fire which means it fires 2 injectors on each side when it fires not quite sure the reasoning behind this but it has worked for a long time , The mass air systems are much better because they use whats called sequential fire which means that when the number 1 cylinder fires only that injector fires makes more sence but good luck finding a mass air system for a 351 most all are speed density . /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

 

[BLADE262US]

OH and LOL you give me $6000 and Ill build us both one **** of a 351. /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

 

[Seabronc]

You could buy a real decent ready to drop in high performance engine for that price. If you go to a 351W you don't need the computer since they ere carbed up till 89 I believe. You would only need a Duraspark II ignition or something like a MSD ignition system. You could do that witha 302, but you will have problems with emissions laws if they check it because 85 and up 302's are all factory EFIs.

If you do a 302 EFI build, you will definately need computer modifications.

Good luck,

>-

 

[Scott Allen Hill]

I have spoken with several other engine rebuilders here in houston and found a place that will upgrade my vehicle to a 347 Stroker engine that will give me about 275hp and 400ft. lbs. of torque. > My horsepower is being limited by the factory computer module which dosen't concern me much at this point. They said that this conversion would cost me about $2700.00 installed. /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" /> What are your thoughts and do you know anyone that has had this modification?

 

[mbtech2003]

my friend that works at ford is doing that to his 89 5.0 mustang i'll askhim tonight and get back to you....i think he is useing the edlebrock torquer kit as well. cam-lifters-heads-intake are all included. i think :glare: is your 302 a **?? i think the main defference is roller lifters rather than solid :-B

update my i didn't talk to my friend today. hopefully monday after the holiday. correct me if i'm wrong but isn't 85 carburated?? :huh: not sure... but when i installed a performance cam in my 95 351 i had no problems with the stock computer handling it. no check engine light eather.

 

[Scott Allen Hill]

my friend that works at ford is doing that to his 89 5.0 mustang i'll askhim tonight and get back to you....i think he is useing the edlebrock torquer kit as well.  cam-lifters-heads-intake are all included.  i think :glare:   is your 302 a **??  i think the main defference is roller lifters rather than solid :-B
update my i didn't talk to my friend today.  hopefully monday after the holiday.  correct me if i'm wrong but isn't 85 carburated?? :huh:   not sure...  but when i installed a performance cam in my 95 351 i had no problems with the stock computer handling it.  no check engine light eather.

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To answer your question in regards to my Bronco being carburated or EFI. The answer is :-& EFI. However, you are correct /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" /> that most 1985 models did come with a carburated engine. The only exception to this were Broncos manufactured for use the great communist state of California. :-B In fact this particular vehicle is very unique in that the 85 Bronco, with the 302 EFI, sold in California was suposed to be a manual transmission. Some how this vehicle is an automatic. I am unsure of how many of this type were manufactured but it is sure to say not many. I hope this clears up the question. Thanks for you assistance.

 

[BLADE262US]

Why spend that much money for a stroked 302 at 347 when you could just get a 351W and be that much farther ahead and cheaper if you have your heart set on a stroker motor spend it for something really good like a 351W stroked to a 427 now that would be worth the money /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

 

[Scott Allen Hill]

Why spend that much money for a stroked 302 at 347 when you could just get a 351W and be that much farther ahead and cheaper if you have your heart set on a stroker motor spend it for something really good like a 351W stroked to a 427 now that would be worth the money  /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

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I probably do just that, if I was going to do the work myself. However, everyone I spoke to, including a trusted mechanic, felt that the cost I would incure for the 351W modification would be more than the 347. $-) With the 347 I will keep all the original parts and will not have to change the intake, oil pan, computer module, exhaust, etc. /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" /> After comparing the benefits and drawbacks of both I decided that the 347 will give me the neccessary power I need for towing my boat. At 275hp and 400 ft. lbs of torque I should be good to go. :-" If I ever want to increase the horsepower I just need to add a new computer module and increase the hp to 375.

<' /> However, if I was made of money there would be a much greater modifications done to this vehicle. :-& #036;

 

[BLADE262US]

LOL I think your missing the point your computer is programmed for the air volume of a 302 I went over this in another post how to figure out the displacement of each cylinder and the total motor . If you stroke that 302 to a 347 the computer still doesnt know that and you have changed the air volume which is undoubtably going to cause it to run lean . This is why the need for a computer change going to a 351 . You can spend your money however you want but if you want my opinion your wasteing it . I fail to see how putting a 351 in it will cost more than a stroker motor . You should be able to pick up a 351 EFI from a scrap yard very reasonable and it cost no more to rebuild a 351 than it does a 302 , No matter what you do your going to change that computer one way or another because those horsepower figures you listed there arent going to happen with it running lean and you will be very dissapointed and have no choice but to spend more money . Best thing to do is to find an injected 351 rebuild it yourself its not hard you can ask me any questions you have I have done alot of them I have 5 of them in service right now . I got my computer from a member of this board very reasonable . Ebay is a wonderful place to get performance parts very cheap and most brand new . Thats my opinion , One thing I do recomend before you do anything is go to www.fordfuelinjection.com and read alot till you understand how the EEC works and speed density fuel injection . /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

 

[Scott Allen Hill]

LOL I think your missing the point your computer is programmed for the air volume of a 302 I went over this in another post how to figure out the displacement of each cylinder and the total motor . If you stroke that 302 to a 347 the computer still doesnt know that and you have changed the air volume which is undoubtably going to cause it to run lean . This is why the need for a computer change going to a 351 . You can spend your money however you want but if you want my opinion your wasteing it . I fail to see how putting a 351 in it will cost more than a stroker motor . You should be able to pick up a 351 EFI from a scrap yard very reasonable and it cost no more to rebuild a 351 than it does a 302 , No matter what you do your going to change that computer one way or another because those horsepower figures you listed there arent going to happen with it running lean and you will be very dissapointed and have no choice but to spend more money . Best thing to do is to find an injected 351 rebuild it yourself its not hard you can ask me any questions you have I have done alot of them I have 5 of them in service right now . I got my computer from a member of this board very reasonable . Ebay is a wonderful place to get performance parts very cheap and most brand new . Thats my opinion , One thing I do recomend before you do anything is go to www.fordfuelinjection.com and read alot till you understand how the EEC works and speed density fuel injection .  /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

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I appreciate your suggestions and am inpressed with your knowledge of this vehicle. I will call the place Monday and see what the cost difference they quote me. If you have any other suggestions please let me know.

 

[curlygrooms]

first off 6 grand is bull....but i just blew my efi 302 and dropped a windsor in and now i have alot more torque and power...i had to change the computer over to an efi 351 computer and do a little exhaust work cuz the 351w is wider and pulls the xhaust apart and up....but other than that the wiring harness is the same except 351w dont have nock sensors so youd have an extra plug not going anywhere.....also if u do this u need to get 351w exhaust manifolds cuz the egr runs directly into the exhaust manifold rather than into the intake as a 302 does...

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i'm also runnin a newer 351 in place of the stock wore out 302.havn't changed the computer yet and it has some low end problems.what kind and where do i get one and how much is the right computer

 

[BLADE262US]

I have a computer here for a 91 that had a 351 with an E4OD when I replaced mine I used one for a 351 with a C6 which I bought from a member here . Fordfuelinjection.com has a list of computer codes and what they are for you could get that list and go to ebay and put in EEC IV or ford computer and then try to match the code with the ones you find on there . I did that for awhile till I found one here . Be very sure what your getting os for a 351 though so its not a waste of your money and if you have an E4OD the computer must be for a 351 with an E4OD and actually whatever tranny your using that should be the computer you want because the timing curves will be a bit different . If you do have an E4OD though I do have a good computer . /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />