Holley Truck Avenger offroad carb

[rodsteal]

Has anyone used the Holley Truck Avenger carb on a 302 and what kind of difference did it make? I currently have an Edelbrock 660 CFM four barrel and do alright, but climbing hills can get tricky with fuel spilling out of the bowl. I noticed the Holley had the anti slosh tube prevent or subdue this. The ad mentioned it was the closest thing to fuel injection in a carb setup. Thanks for the help.

 

[S_bolt19]

I have heard that the TAs are ok. Me personally, I wouldn't trust a Holley in an offroad vehicle. If you want to stay with a carb, then I would look at maybe a smaller 4 bbl Edelbrock or maybe even finding a way to go back to the Motorcraft. The problem with Holleys, and I don't care what anyone else says, I have been through 3 of them, they have to be adjusted almost everytime you go offroad. They don't jet them correct, the floats aren't adjusted and honestly, they cost more than what kind of headache you will end up going through. I would seriously look into just going with fuel injection if you want to spend the couple hundred dollars on that carb. Look at it this way, the standard EFI (Mustang, Cougar, T-bird, Grand Marquis) is more reliable than a carb in any offroad situation. And you can get them at the pick and pull junkyards for around $200 for everything.

In a nutshell, I wouldn't go down the Holley road if you can hold off and just buy the EFI stuff.

 

[rodsteal]

I have heard that the TAs are ok. Me personally, I wouldn't trust a Holley in an offroad vehicle. If you want to stay with a carb, then I would look at maybe a smaller 4 bbl Edelbrock or maybe even finding a way to go back to the Motorcraft. The problem with Holleys, and I don't care what anyone else says, I have been through 3 of them, they have to be adjusted almost everytime you go offroad. They don't jet them correct, the floats aren't adjusted and honestly, they cost more than what kind of headache you will end up going through. I would seriously look into just going with fuel injection if you want to spend the couple hundred dollars on that carb. Look at it this way, the standard EFI (Mustang, Cougar, T-bird, Grand Marquis) is more reliable than a carb in any offroad situation. And you can get them at the pick and pull junkyards for around $200 for everything.
In a nutshell, I wouldn't go down the Holley road if you can hold off and just buy the EFI stuff.

The only problem I run into with EFI is worrying about the computer going out. Not a consern with a carb.

 

[Bully Bob]

Check me on this, but...., I believe Edelb. has an "offroad" kit for that carb.

 

[Seabronc]

I don't believe I'm saying this , but why spend the money on another carb for an off road vehicle. I definitely believe that EFI is the better choice here, and for the price of a Truck Avenger, you could probably get an entire EFI setup + from a donor truck.

Good luck,

>-

 

[S_bolt19]

The only problem I run into with EFI is worrying about the computer going out. Not a consern with a carb.

I have been running EFI since 2002 now & I have never once had a problem with the computer. I know guys who have had EFI in their EBs for almost 15 years and they have never had a problem. Honestly, I have never heard of the computer going out in a swap. The only problem with the EFI is that you are going to have trouble finding the desirable mass air system. Most of the time if there is a MA system, people usually rob the throttle bodies and leave the rest. Even on the speed density systems they do that, but once you go EFI, you will wonder why you didn't do it sooner. I was semi-reluctant to go EFI & I was talked into it, and next to putting on PS & PB, I don't know what I was thinking without it. Just having it on the trail the first time, you are gonna be blown away. Just my .02 though :-" /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

 

[Broncobill78]

Yup, no question about it. I would STRONGLY advise you to listen to SeaBronc & S bolt. There's NO QUESTION that EFI is WAY better than a carb for off-roading. If you're looking at a new carb I admit it's not cheap but the Holly Pro-Jection throtte-body EFI systems are pretty damn slick. You get a throttle body & stand-alone processor (one that's capable of running in either open or closed circuit modes) and it will absolutely amaze you how much better it is, throttle response, milage, drivability, off-camber situations, all of it. The EFI has the carbs beat hands down.

Now if you DON'T want to go that route for whatever reason I would again backstop S bolt and say that Holley's need an incredible ammount of massaging to run well off-road. They're street/strip carbs and while they CAN be adapted to off-road they don't do well out of the box or without at leat $100 worth of add-on's. The Carter/Edelbrock's or even a tuned Motorcraft carb are better choices

have to say that I too have *never* heard of an EFI comp going bad at all, much less at a vunerable moment. EFI is honestly the way to go but understandably not everyone has the &&& throw at it. If you choose to stick w/a carb I would really listen to the advise you've been given and stay away from the Holley's.

 

[Justshootme84]

I'll disagree with everyone here, and say the Holley Truck Avenger is the best offroad carb you can get, hands down. while it's true that other Holleys are finicky, that's not the case with the TA. Several folks I know use them, and I have one on my 460 in the 84. They run about $425 from JEG's. JSM84

 

[S_bolt19]

And I can get a complete H.O. Fuel injection setup that is more reilable and has better output from a junkyard for $200.

 

[Justshootme84]

And I can get a complete H.O. Fuel injection setup that is more reilable and has better output from a junkyard for $200.

While that may be true, the original question wasw whether or not the TA was a good carb, not should one swap to EFI or not. Some of us are hardheaded and will not convert a carbed rig to EFI, or in my case choose to convert an EFI motor to a carb. That's all I'm saying, right or wrong. JSM84

 

[Broncobill78]

JSM, How so ? Not to disagree (well, ok maybe) but for $600 you can snag a Pro-Jection brand new and for considerably less you can get a junkyard MFI complete w/intake, injectors, fuel rails & processor. Granted it's a lot more work but the pro-jection can be installed by a high-functioning *challenged* individual and the factory MFI offeres superior everything. Now I don't disagree that the Holley with all it's add-ons DOES work off-road, but it STILL requires some tuning (not always easily accomplished by noobs) and the fuelie systems are almost idiot-proof once installed. Now if Holley sold the TA for $200 it might be one thing, but it seems to me that they charge a premium to add on all the things it should have had to *begin with* and even then it needs tweeking right out of the box. As *I* see it, you can install fuel injection for the same ammount of $$ or bull$hit as the TA and you reap a whole lot more. I'll grant that carbs are MUCH easier to diagnose & repair on-site but the advantages in MPG, drivability & performance outweight that IMHOP. I don't deny that it's a good carb, I just think it costs a whole lot more than it should for what you get.

 

[Justshootme84]

JSM, How so ? Not to disagree (well, ok maybe) but for $600 you can snag a Pro-Jection brand new and for considerably less you can get a junkyard MFI complete w/intake, injectors, fuel rails & processor. Granted it's a lot more work but the pro-jection can be installed by a high-functioning *challenged* individual and the factory MFI offeres superior everything. Now I don't disagree that the Holley with all it's add-ons DOES work off-road, but it STILL requires some tuning (not always easily accomplished by noobs) and the fuelie systems are almost idiot-proof once installed. Now if Holley sold the TA for $200 it might be one thing, but it seems to me that they charge a premium to add on all the things it should have had to *begin with* and even then it needs tweeking right out of the box. As *I* see it, you can install fuel injection for the same ammount of $$ or bull$hit as the TA and you reap a whole lot more. I'll grant that carbs are MUCH easier to diagnose & repair on-site but the advantages in MPG, drivability & performance outweight that IMHOP. I don't deny that it's a good carb, I just think it costs a whole lot more than it should for what you get.

You answered the question for me with your post. it's alot more work to convert a carbed rig to EFI than it is to change the carb or tune it with a wrench. I have mostly used the Edelbrock 1400 series carbs on my 4x4's, and that's what the 78 and 79 have at present. I happen to like theses carbs for their affordability and out-of-the-box, ready-to-run factor. My TA is the same way, as it is for other folks I've spoken to and rode with. I've seen fights break out between brothers trying to tune a Holley double-pumper, and I think most folks feel that way about Holley carbs in general. That's why i refer to those as "finicky" in a general sense.

 

[Broncobill78]

Oh I LOVE it. Beautiful man, BEAUTIFUL. You're absolutely right and I can't dispute a word of it. Your post makes me remember watching a couple guys who'd been friends for 20+ yrs take 1.5" WRENCHES to each other over this issue up in the Green Mountains. I watched them throw spark plugs & injectors at each other over this and I'm laughing so hard it's difficult to type right now, much less grab another beer. Without a doubt I agree and you're right, the Carb setup IS much easier to install AND troubleshoot. A bonehead can see that. On the other side the MFI setup offers *much* greater offf-camber performance, drivability & daily milage. To be perfectly honest with everyone I've NEVER seen anything like a Holley to spark a wrench-throwing contest or ******* match so why it's any different here I have no idea <grin>. Everyone has their own ideas about it but to be honest I think the most important thing is to RESPECT everyone's right to their own opinion. I've said my piece and before anyone throws a wrench at me I'm happy to be done with it and let opinions be opinions. Truth be told I think Holleys work just fine but they just take more tweeking than I like to put into an induction system. It is what it is, I have nothing but RESPECT for the guys who've been doing more of this for longer than I have. To each his own.

 

[Bully Bob]

Hay BB78...,You'd make a great politican..! (ha) /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

Folks need to remember ...some folks struggle changing/gapping spark plugs ...if you get my drift..!

rodsteal appears to be quite capable of sett'n up a carb system.

Had a Holl. 750 double pumper on my 80 MPH 18' Cole & that carb saved my life several times...even after swallowing big gobs of water... :-& in 5' swells. Never missed a beat & it don't get much rougher than in a high-speed boat in roughwater.

Had several 4x4 rigs with holleys.....none were new...they all worked flawlessly..even my l'il 1 brl I have now.

Folks post problems here..but rarely come back if things are work'n fine.. |-)

"All systems operate in a failure mode" ..... 4 like rigs with 4 diff. fuel systems traveling together would be the only "true" test.

Wish everyone a sputterless trailride.....

B

 

[S_bolt19]

4 like rigs with 4 diff. fuel systems traveling together would be the only "true" test.

That is where I am coming from on my opinions on Holleys. Only I used the same everything, just swapped the carbs. I went through three different Holleys, all the exact same carb. I also used 2 different Motorcraft carbs and for street use, I will not argue against a Holley. They were absolutely amazing. Great response and MPG. As soon as my front tires hit dirt, those things, every one of the Holleys, would die or have to have some adjustment. I used to carry a complete rebuild kit with me at all times when I went wheelin' for them because it never failed that something happened. I got to the point where I thought it was me so I had a professional set each one of them up for me with the same dead beat results. The Motorcraft carbs never failed. Not once. I was real reluctant to go to EFI but I got talked into it by a guy who owns one of the largest EB junkyards in the country & has been building EBs since the mid 70s. He pushed me real hard and was the one that told me to stay away from any Holleys in the first place. I didn't take his advice and ended up spending over $1500 on carbs & tuning bills. Add that to the cost of my EFI rebuild and swap and I could have had one screaming engine. Not to mention, Holleys have left me hanging within an inch of my life before, literally. That NEVER happened with a Motorcraft or my EFI.

I don't care what you guys say, I know what happened to me and I will go to any length to stress that Holleys are a piece of crap when it comes to an off road vehicle. For the time & money that you will spend in additional tuning, the extra add ons like BB78 mentioned and all the other stuff, good money is going into putting an EFI on. Especially for offroad & MPG.

 

[aqua_wonder]

I never had any issues with 2 barrel Holleys. Never had any stalling issues or fuel problems. I stuck the truck on its rear bumper and the engine was still idling. I only tuned the carb maybe once out of the box and took it offroad over 100 times. I had engine issues and everyone told me it was the carb, instead it was weak valves. The engine was tired after 30 years. I stuck in a fresh engine and tuned it once since then. I had an edelbrock on another rig and at steep angles the truck always stalled out. A buddy had the same drivetrain but he had a truck avenger and it never stalled. Six of one and half a dozen of another. I wouldn't say that all Holley's are crap for offroading. I had issues with the edelbrock cause it was starving for fuel at steep inclines, I wouldn't say that it was a bad carb.

 

[Bully Bob]

I know...,

It's like the 'ole "Chev. Ford, Dodge" debates....I've always had Chevrolets but look at me now...2 Fords.., Go figure..?

I guess whatever works for you, run with it..!!

All the guys on this board are very accurate & you can pretty much, "take the advice to the bank"..!!

We've all had bad luck with diff. items & products...especially these days. :angry:

Geeeze...... I've bought stuff..., took it back.., & they say... "HAY I sold it to you....you don't expect it to work too do you..??" @-)

BTW I absolutely love the "FI" on my F-150 PU...

 

[Broncobill78]

Well, I said the same thing in a similar thread but I can honestly see both sides of the arguement. Carbs are dead nuts simple and easy to work with. I once drove 200+ miles home from the Green Mtns in Vt to central Mass with a 2.5" gal gas tank duct-taped to my hood w/a bulkhead fitting in it and 5' of scavenged fuel line dripping fuel into the carb venturi thru a crimp. You just can't DO that with EFI. ****BUT****, like S bolt I've been halfway up a tough off-camber incline and had my Holley die right out of the blue. Wound up sliding 300ft down the hill on my side & being thankfull the whole time that I'd invested in a frame-mounted rollcage ( VERY embarassing and not cheap to fix). NOT something I'd like to do a second time. Carbs can flood & foul at the worst of times. For ME at least it always seems like they flood out just when I'm trying to cross deep water or when I'm hitting big rocks & trying to get up a hill. Putting your right foot down and having the engine bog in a cloud of black smoke is NOT what you want in a hill-climb event or at any other time. I honestly DO understand the carb guys because I've had a carb bring me 200+ miles home after a fuel pump failure and I really do know how easy they are to fix & to run but at the same time I've had carbs *fail* me more times than they've saved me and when I factor in the added drivability, performance & MPG I have to go for the EFI, but that's NOT to say that I don't understand the carb arguement and agree with it on many levels. Like I said earlier, I've NEVER seen anything like a Holley to spark an arguement <grin>

 

[rodsteal]

It is interesting to read this post and see where it has gone over the weekend.

First of all, thank you JSM84 for realizing that I wasn't asking if I should change to EFI and looking for a cost break down and the benefits of going from a carb to EFI. Every other vehicle I own except for my 71 MGB has EFI and I am keeping my EB carbureted as well. In the age we live where everything is electric and automated, I am keeping the classic set up. You want to talk computers and EFI, we can talk about my S500 or my wife