5.0 TO 5.8 PROS AND CONS

[famousguy_fsas]

OK SO I HAVE HAD BOTH ENGINES. A 351 EFI AND THE 5.0 MULTIPORT EFI. SO FAR ALL I HAVE NOTICED IS THAT I BURNT OUT MY ALTERNATOR ON THE 5.0 CAUSE ITS IN A DUMB SPOT AT THE BOTTOM OF THE ENGINE. FIRST THING TO HIT THE DEEP MUD.

SO WHICH ONE DO YOU GUYS THING IS BETTER? AND WHY

NEXT QUESTION. IF I WANTED TO SWITCH TO THE 5.8. WHAT WOULD THAT INVOLVE? WILL THE MOUNTS MATCH? WILL I NEED A NEW TRANNY. ALL NEW WIRING TO HUH? IS IT WORTH IT? OR SHOULD I JUST WAIT TILL I CAN AFFORD THE FORD LIGHTNING MOTOR HAHA

 

[American Thunder]

OK SO I HAVE HAD BOTH ENGINES. A 351 EFI AND THE 5.0 MULTIPORT EFI. SO FAR ALL I HAVE NOTICED IS THAT I BURNT OUT MY ALTERNATOR ON THE 5.0 CAUSE ITS IN A DUMB SPOT AT THE BOTTOM OF THE ENGINE. FIRST THING TO HIT THE DEEP MUD.
SO WHICH ONE DO YOU GUYS THING IS BETTER? AND WHY

NEXT QUESTION. IF I WANTED TO SWITCH TO THE 5.8. WHAT WOULD THAT INVOLVE? WILL THE MOUNTS MATCH? WILL I NEED A NEW TRANNY. ALL NEW WIRING TO HUH? IS IT WORTH IT? OR SHOULD I JUST WAIT TILL I CAN AFFORD THE FORD LIGHTNING MOTOR HAHA

A 351W will bolt in where a 302 used to be. Same mounts, bellhousing, etc. I can't remember if the 351W has a 50 oz imbalance flexplate like the 5.0 efi does, or the older 28 oz imbalance.. Gotta check on that. If it has the same weight on it, you can even use the same flexplate.

The main difference in the 351W is the exhaust, though the stock manifolds will bolt up, (since they both use the same heads) the headpipe is slightly wider for the 351W.

The 5.8 is a LOT better in a truck than a 5.0. It's 50 cubes bigger, due to its 1/2" longer crankshaft stroke. Which means more peak torque, and at a lower rpm. There's no comparison in stock trim, the 5.8 will stomp on the 5.0.

 

[Broncobill78]

What, did your cap-lock key get stuck or something ? No need to shout at us /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

There's no real mystery to this one. You gain horsepower & torque at the expense of weight & mileage. The weight difference between them is pretty much a non-issue with a truck but it *is* noticeable in something smaller like a fox body. It's always a judgment call but it comes down to context, *how* do you plan to use the engine. The 302 is perfectly adequate in a daily driver and will give you about the best mileage you're going to get (the I6/300 is a bit more economical) but you'll be completely dissatisfied with it if you tow anything heavy on a regular basis or plan to compete with the truck on any level. The 351 has the HP/torque advantage right out of the box and can also be stroked to a larger maximum displacement but there's always a price tag attached to mods like that (the cost of the parts, machinework and reduced mileage).

If you're looking for more performance then upgrading to a larger cubic displacement is *always* the way to go. Using better carbs, EFI setups, cams, heads, exhaust, etc are all well and good but at the end of the day those modifications are just ways to increase power without stroking or replacing the existing engine. If you're serious about your interest in a lightning mill then I'd suggest giving some thought to a 460 swap. A basically stock 7.5 liter engine (I'm talking about using the stock reciprocating assembly & heads with aftermarket cam, headers & chip) will crush a 5.0/5.8. When you drive the truck the difference is *literally* night & day, it'll take months to get the stupid looking grin off your face. A number of guys here have done this swap, ask for some opinions.

As far as the 5.8 swap goes it's a pretty straightforward bolt in with the exception of the difference in exhaust port height that American Thunder pointed out. Both engines are great, which one is actually better can only be answered by asking what you intend to do with it. If you want more performance then it's like The Man says, no replacement for displacement.

 

[famousguy_fsas]

my truck is a daily driver for now. but when i decide to do the new engine and everything ill just get a new daily driver. so basically i will be building it for a street leagal off road machine. like i have expressed in other posts. 1 ton swap sas. cage. everything possible. but what really set me not liking the 5.0 recently is i dont like where the alt is. but i was serious about the lightning engine. i just know it will be expensive. and i honestly have no clue what size the lightning is. so tell me about this 460. what does it come out of and what mods will need to be done. cause i want the power. who cares about gas millage. will i need new tranny? wiring? what else will i need new to make fit? will the motor mount placement match?

 

[famousguy_fsas]

so i did some reasearch on the 460 and the lightning engines. didnt know the earlier lightning engine was a 5.8 w. so that one would bolt right up right? but is only 240 hp. now the newer lighning 5.4 triton comes with 360 and 380 hp how well would that fit? would all that bolt right up? tranny and mounts and all. cause i did some reading about the 460 and it only has 433 hp and from what i read its parts are way expensive. the engine is way hard to find and it wont bolt right up at all. im looking for the best thing that i can almost bolt right in will few mods. but still get tons of power. im thinkin one of the lightning engines. so will they both fit rigtht in or will the 5.8 lightning be the only one to fit right in. what bout the 5.4 triton. sorry this post was all over the place haha

 

[Broncobill78]

I just gotta ask, *where* are you reading this stuff ? ONLY 433hp /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" /> Ask around & see what it'll cost you to get that kind of horsepower out of a 351. Stock 460's produce considerably less than 433 but they can easily crank out up to 1000hp. The 5.4 is a modular motor and a whole different ballgame, you'd be looking at quite a project with that. Not that it can't be done but a 460 is a much easier bolt in since it was available in F-trucks to begin with (yes, I know the 5.4 is also but we're talking about entirely different generation trucks with very different frames & engine compartments). 460's are very common engines you can find them in large passenger cars from 68 on up as well as vans & F-trucks. Go to any junkyard & you can't throw a rock without hitting one. You can get an easy 500hp from a stock 2-bolt main 460 block as a general rule the stock 460 block is good to 600hp right out of the box, 700HP with main studs, 900HP with stud & girdle kit and 1000+HP with 4-bolt conversion with forged caps. The kit from L&L products makes the 460 swap effortless but you can also do it by scrounging factory parts. Parts aren't very expensive either since there are so many of them (it was in production from 68' to 96'). Not that the lightning engine isn't a good one it's just expensive, for what you'd pay for one you can build a 500+ big block.

Bottom line here is that if torque and horsepower are what you're looking for you will *not* find cheaper or more reliable HP than the 460.

You'll find some accurate info over on the 460 forum:

http://460ford.com/forum/index.php

 

[92bronco_in_progress]

the only downside is decreased mileage, but its not too bad....i get about 270 miles to the tank

 

[bronco410w]

as the person said above about the exhust... the 351w has a taller deck then the 302... there for the top end of the motor is up higher and since it has a taller deck , the exhust header/ manifolds will be higher andwider.... also, you cant use a 302 intake... you need to get a 351w intake... "351w are wider" ...... i have a 351w stroked to a 410 .... i made 654hp to the back tires all motor ... im also hitting it with a 350 shot of n2o.... "my mustang" .... 351w are good motors and there are plenty of parts out there for them... you can build a motor fairly cheap ... but you can also get you'r self into some big $$$ ... basicly it comes down to how much money you have, and how much the old lady will let you spend.... lol

also my old 302 based block 347ci made 433hp to the tires... not bad for a lil small block!

 

[famousguy_fsas]

im looking for the most hp out of the easiest bolt on instalation. so the 460. what does it take to put that in my truck/ how much heavier is it then the 5.0 and 5.8

 

[Broncobill78]

The 302 is 460/500lbs, 351W is 525 and the 460 is 635. The numbers are pretty academic, trucks can easily handle an extra 150lbs up front. If this was a fox body mustang/T-bird, a tube chassis car or an Early Bronco you'd need to swap to larger/stiffer springs & swaybars but you won't even notice the difference in a full size Bronco

L&L products does nothing but make kits to swap 460's into Broncos & F150's. http://www.landlproducts.com/list.aspx?cID=1 The L&L kits come with motor mounts, oil pan, accessory brackets, headers, everything you need.

Since the 460 came stock in F-trucks you can swap one into a Bronco using factory parts. Some companies sell motor mount/oil pan kits to do this but they usually leave you on your own to figure out accessories and exhaust. I went this way the first time around and ran into problems fitting the L&L fenderwell headers because I had factory motor mounts that raised the engine too far causing the passenger header collector to contact the body mount. Everything in the L&L kits works well together if you go the piecemeal route you'll spend less $$$ but you'll have to spend more time fine-tuning your installation.

The EASIEST bolt-in will be to replace what you currently have with the exact same thing, that's *easiest*. The MOST POWER is most definitely going to come from a 460. Somewhere along the line you'll have to make a choice. The 460 is an easy bolt in with the L&L kit and it's still a pretty easy swap even without the kit but realistically it's not as easy as swapping a 302 for a 302. It *will* however make way more power than a 302 or 351.

 

[famousguy_fsas]

ya as long as land l makes a kit for it to be bolt on thats fine. all i mean by bolt on is i dont have the means and equiptment to be cutting welding and fabing stuff up.

 

[Broncobill78]

I wasn't exaggerating when I said the L&L kit makes the swap effortless. Now I've only used it for the 78/79 Bronco but I know a number of other guys here have used it for the 80-96 and I've never heard a complaint about either the company or the kit. The only difference between the one I've used and the kit for yours is the 80-96 kit includes a remote oil filter setup that the 78/79 doesn't need.

http://www.landlproducts.com/details.aspx?...amp;ItemID=1127

Maybe someone who's used the kit on the 80-96 will have an opinion but I really don't think you'll find anyone with a bad thing to say about the kit, company or swap. Obviously the mileage will drop but if that's not an issue than I honestly don't think you'll find a better swap to give you more power for less money.

 

[American Thunder]

My 4bbl 302 Bronco was averaging about 10 mpg before I swapped out the motor. I bet a 4bbl 460 would have improved the highway mileage if anything!