1990 EFI to Carb conversion

[miesk5]

Yo Rod,

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[MaximusBronk]

 

[MaximusBronk]

Gentlemen, and Ladies,

I would like to point out that Baumann Electronics (that supplies the Quick-4 transmission controller I have installed) has been A+ on customer support.  Sure, I said that this conversion was not easy, but for a mechanically minded individual that wants to buck the system, it really isn't that hard.  It will take some time to trace out wires, etc.  And you will have to replace your camshaft if you are changing from EFI to Carbuerator.  But when it comes down to the electronically controlled transmission, after tossing the engine computer, Baumann will support you 100%.  They provide baseline tranny control profiles for each transmission model.  I have NO dog in this.  I am speaking as a fellow Bronco owner.  They have been fully supportive with a simple phone call each time.  And if you have a question about your transmission's characteristics after experimenting with the basic profile they provide for your transmission model, you simply record the current running condition with their "US Shiftware" software record function, and email it to them.  They will look at the tranny profile, and take your concerns into question, and offer suggestions, as well as a modified profile to download into your Quick-4 tranny controller.  Best customer service I have experienced, Gentlemen.  And you will see on Holley carbuerator's documentation that you should never use a Holley on an overdrive transmission.  But the Quick-4 accomodates for the reasoning behind this.  The Quick-4 will allow you to use an AOD, or E4OD tranny with virtually any engine, or model year.  And it is really fun to be able to have your laptop sitting in the passenger seat while experimenting with your transmission, and building different running profiles.  You can build as many as four different profiles to run from, and select them directly form the controller mounted on your dash.  Using your laptop to set it up makes the job simpler, but after the profiles are saved to the dash controller, you may instantly select which ever one you wish to run from.  At this time, I only have two profiles..... Performance, and Economy. 

Rod

 

[Seabronc]

Also, Fred posted on 27 Sept in this topic that only the older 351 engines were capable of handling removal of emission controls, and that doing so could damage some components on later model engines such as this one.  I need to point out that this short block is an ATK high performance block that I replaced the original with years ago.  I do not know if that changes what Fred mentioned about later models being sensitive to such conversions, or if he was referring to the long block components.  If you are reading this, Fred, could you be specific as to the possible damage to original blocks that attempt this conversion, Sir?

It looks like the changes you made pretty much null and void my comment.  It is relevant to simply ripping off the controls from a stock engine run by a computer that is tuned to the factory installation.  A lot of people do that without any consideration to other changes that need to be made.  You will probably find a lot of,  "would be", inexperienced wrenchers do not realize or consider other changes that are necessary when making any kind of change.  They seem to think they know more than the engineers that designed the engine.

Hope that makes sense  :blink:

Just getting old and tired I guess  /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

>-

PS you can post in the thread by selecting more reply options 

 

[MaximusBronk]

Thanks Fred.

I agree that the standard factory block could very well have negative implications that would be a problem for anybody contemplating this conversion.  Unfortunately, without your knowledge, I do not know which things would cause detrimental problems starting with a factory short block.  As I said before, my short block is an ATK high performance model that may not be identical to the factory model.  But I would be interested in what differences there could be between the two.  I am not asking you to get back on your "soap box" as you put it, but I think that all of us would like to know what implications there would be, even though we would be asking you to reiterate prior topics that have already been covered by yourself.  Most of all, I do not want to send our readers in a direction that could cause them problems or damage.  I am only giving my personal experience based upon my current hardware, which would likely be different than the usual Bronco owner.  Having said that, may we all ask you to once again get upon that soap box, and save others from problems?  I am interested myself too, Sir.

Many Thanks,

Rod

 

[Seabronc]

I will think about that.  I'll gather my thoughts and get back to it.

>-

 

[gunnyP]

Ron-

Thanks for this topic. I'm am considering/planning a ATK Long block crate motor swap with my 351w EFI. It already has the carb/intake/distributor and other stuff on it. I believe it will run as is. The question had been bumping around my head has been how to control the transmission and you have the answer. Thanks for that. I appreciate any other insights that you may have!

gunny

 

[MaximusBronk]

Gunny,

If you need any advice, please feel free to ask.  Baumann has great customer support.  I had an issue with a hard shift from 1st to 2nd, and they had me upload the shift profile from the tranny controller to my laptop and send it to Jake in support department.  Uploading and downloading shifting profiles is only a matter of plugging a USB cable they provide to you into the controller, and you have instant communication with the controller.  No BS with setting up communication at all.  He always gets back to you within 48 hours.  He modified the profile and sent it back to me, and I downloaded it to my tranny controller.  Much better, but still playing with it.  I have been driving around the city with a laptop plugged in to view the shifting in real-time.  Needless to say, I have learned much about automatic transmissions.  Being able to watch the shifting take place on a laptop screen is interesting to say the least.  Best to have a friend drive while you do the viewing and tuning!

I will be up in North Texas very soon if you would like to go for a test drive.  Send me a PM and I will arrange it offline if you want to meet up.

Rod

 

[gunnyP]

Rod-

I'm close to the end of my swap project. I'm to the wiring tracing bit. A bit daunting. Do you have any wiring diagrams or notes Anything would help.

You had to replace the fuel pump with a lower pressure version... could you elaborate on that for me? 

Thanks,

gunny

 

[miesk5]

Yo Gunny,

PM MaximusBronk for the info in event he doesn't look at your question.

 

[cbr1000dude]

In regard to the fuel pressure issue, I have some experience with the 4160 Holley carb in my boat. It is a 351 engine also. The fuel pressure cannot exceed much over 4 psi, or it will overcome the float valve's ability to shut off the fuel, especially after the engine is shut down. At 6-10 psi, it will continue to drip and flood the engine. EFI fuel pumps have much higher pressure, I don't know exactly what the Bronco is, but it's probably more like 30 to 40 psi.

It's a bigger problem in a ski boat with a closed engine compartment that is run ******* hot days, and shut off and restarted many times as skiers get in and out of the boat. I added a Holley adjustable fuel pressure regulator (about $100) because my new "low pressure" fuel pump still flooded the engine. This was after I spent $650 on a new carb trying to solve the problem. And don't even consider a $25 Autozone fuel pressure regulator. Erratic and they leak.

Of course, I learned all this the hard way (much frustration and money), so perhaps this will help someone avoid the same.

 

[cbr1000dude]

One more point on the Holley 4160. These carbs, especially the float design, were designed for fuel that was much different than the fuel available today.  That's partly why they are so sensitive to fuel pressure. I'm certainly no expert. But what I got from reading experts talking about it is that the modern fuel doesn't float the float as high as the old fuel because it's less volatile. The marine versions don't have externally adjustable floats, they need to be disassembled and the tang bent. Getting it right is a fight between flooding and starving.

I'm very happy with the EFI in my Bronco, I'm burned out on carbs at this point in my life.

 

[MaximusBronk]

I did indeed install a lower pressure fuel pump in my Bronco when I did the carb change, as well as an emergency backup in the engine compartment parallel to the fuel line that can be rerouted in about 15 mins.  I also answered Gunny's PM on the issue a couple weeks ago.

 

[gunnyP]

Thanks guys. I ended up putting in a Holley Fuel Pressure regulator and a return line back to the fuel tank. My system is set at 7 psi and is working well. I kept the pump in the tank. The conversion as hard enough without having to pull the fuel tank as well

gunny

 

[Jlawson]

Gentlemen, and Ladies,

I would like to point out that Baumann Electronics (that supplies the Quick-4 transmission controller I have installed) has been A+ on customer support. Sure, I said that this conversion was not easy, but for a mechanically minded individual that wants to buck the system, it really isn't that hard. It will take some time to trace out wires, etc. And you will have to replace your camshaft if you are changing from EFI to Carbuerator. But when it comes down to the electronically controlled transmission, after tossing the engine computer, Baumann will support you 100%. They provide baseline tranny control profiles for each transmission model. I have NO dog in this. I am speaking as a fellow Bronco owner. They have been fully supportive with a simple phone call each time. And if you have a question about your transmission's characteristics after experimenting with the basic profile they provide for your transmission model, you simply record the current running condition with their "US Shiftware" software record function, and email it to them. They will look at the tranny profile, and take your concerns into question, and offer suggestions, as well as a modified profile to download into your Quick-4 tranny controller. Best customer service I have experienced, Gentlemen. And you will see on Holley carbuerator's documentation that you should never use a Holley on an overdrive transmission. But the Quick-4 accomodates for the reasoning behind this. The Quick-4 will allow you to use an AOD, or E4OD tranny with virtually any engine, or model year. And it is really fun to be able to have your laptop sitting in the passenger seat while experimenting with your transmission, and building different running profiles. You can build as many as four different profiles to run from, and select them directly form the controller mounted on your dash. Using your laptop to set it up makes the job simpler, but after the profiles are saved to the dash controller, you may instantly select which ever one you wish to run from. At this time, I only have two profiles..... Performance, and Economy.

Rod

How did you wire it up? As soon as my mech wired it up. We lost our tac and rpm

 

[Tiha]

How did you wire it up? As soon as my mech wired it up. We lost our tac and rpm

What are you using for igniton module? Or just a standard distributor?

That tach signal comes from the distributor.