roll cage and snorkel

[swampthing]

I have an 85 bronco with a worked 302 and i am making a snorkel for it, trying to make my mind up on wether or not i should do 3 , 3 1/2, or 4 inch piping. I am also doing a roll cage just cant decide whether i want to keep it basic or do a full cage in it. I already have 5 point harness on the driver side and its soon getting 2 summit racing seats and new 5 point harnesses. I would appreciate any opinions and suggestions &lt

 

[Bigone96]

If you are going to build a full roll cage make sure it is mounted to the frame not the bolt on the body crap it is worthless in a rollover. I recomend using atleast 2''x.120 DOM steel tube that is what I built mine out of. If you have deep pockets use chromoly 4130. Some guys would use 1 1/2" but stronger is always better.

Barta

 

[Bigone96]

oh yeah one other thing if you choose to do a rollcage you are going to need a tubing bender and they are not cheap. If you need one get a hold of M-Tech supply. Remember that you need a tubing bender not a pipe bender if you try to bend tube with a pipe bender it will kink. Tube goes by O.D (outside diameter) pipe goes by I.D (inside diameter).

Barta

 

[swampthing]

thanx man i appreciate it but i think i am going to save myself the hassle and just have it built at a fab shop because right now i lack a welder and tubing bender which sucks majorly...I just have to decide whether or not i wanna go full out with it yet or not

 

[Justshootme84]

swampthing, I would try to use a 4" pipe for your snorkel. The more air, the bettre. ON that subject, I saw a mudracing Bronco on some T.V. show [ maybe it was Exreme 4X4] that re-routed the air intake inside the cab by cuttin a hole in near the glove box. Just another option.

On the rollcage, check out my post on the S&W Racecars cage kit that I'm installing in my 84 Bronco. You still need a welder and tools to install it, but the pieces are already bent where needed. Even if you have to get someone to weld it up, it's still alot cheaper than having a shop make one for you. The tubing is 1-5/8"x0.134" wall mild steel tubing. You can also see what other folks have done with different cage installs by doing a search at FullSizeBronco.com and Pirate4X4.com I found a ton of good rollcage info at both of those sites.

Whatever design you go with, I agree that it should be tied to the frame in some form. The floorpan is paper thin and I doubt it would support any kind of rollcage in an accident.

 

[Broncoholics]

Get that cage in fast because I've heard too many horror stories with people using 5 point harnesses without a cage. @-)

When mounting the cage to the frame get those pre bent bars that weld to frame and bolt to the underside of the body. This way the body can still be removed. Both mounts upper cage to lower mount match up together sandwitching the body between. Don't let them drill through the cab floor for the tubes to pass thru.

 

[swampthing]

thanx a lot for your advice... i am gonna check around a couple places to see about pre made cages for it but if i cant find anything i like i am going to take it to a metal shop and get an estimate. i MIGHT be getting a welder within a couple of weeks so i can still get them to bend everythingand i will bolt it all in! Thanks again

 

[Broncoholics]

Heck all you really need is a welder and a grinder. Maybe a sawzall or a cut off blade for the skillsaw. The prebent bars are the way to go.

 

[ocalabronco]

IMO, 2" is going to be WAY to bulky to use for your cage. you can get away with using 1.75" DOM for your cage. thats the size that most all the fabricators on FSB use, and it works just fine. and for the snorkel, 3" is the minimum i would use. depending on where you run it, 4" may be rather bulky and block your view. i've got 3" tubing im going to use for mine, and it doesnt block my view at all

 

[Justshootme84]

Get that cage in fast because I've heard too many horror stories with people using 5 point harnesses without a cage.  @-)   When mounting the cage to the frame get those pre bent bars that weld to frame and bolt to the underside of the body.  This way the body can still be removed. Both mounts upper cage to lower mount match up together sandwitching the body between.  Don't let them drill through the cab floor for the tubes to pass thru.

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I was curious about your last sentence. " Don't let them drill htrough the cab floor for the tubes to pass thru." I had thought about using a "slug" or smaller-diameter tubing to insert thru the floor into the cage, that are welded to the frame mounts from below. I've read about this on some sites as this will reduce the side-to-side motion of the cage-to-floor mounts that tie into the frame from below. Do you have some further insight on good/bad of this type of mount???

 

[Broncoholics]

I've heard a bit about it. Its strong and probably the best route to take.

Here's a link that can give you some ideas of ways to tie in the cage to frame thats easy and cheap. Scroll to the bottom. These are for early Broncos but will get you the idea for any rig. Make them yourself.

http://completeoffroad.com/wsm/c-19_66-77_..._roll_cage.html

 

[ocalabronco]

sandwiching the body is probably the best way to go about tying the cage into the frame, like BH said. if you really want to, you could even integrate bushings into the mounts so it wouldnt creak as bad and didn't totally tweak out the body

 

[Justshootme84]

I will check out that link, thanks!!! I do plan to use a bushing- type mount to the frame, and 1/4" thick metal plates under the top floor plates, bolted together. Each place that the rollcage is mounted to the floor has a different style connection to the frame, due to the stock body mount locations and clearance with other items, like the front radius arms mounts and rear spring hangers. I'll have to work on that in the next few weeks when work slows down, but will post more pics at SFO and in my thread here at BZ. Thanks for everyone's great advice!!!

 

[swampthing]

i just got my welder today thank god so i am going to order a pre made cage and just weld everything up myself. as far as the floors go i cam gonna run braces from the frame up to the bottom of the cage mounts i think i should be ok there...if i flip it i flip it doesnt bother me and if you never see me on here again you know my idea failed

 

[Justshootme84]

i just got my welder today thank god so i am going to order a pre made cage and just weld everything up myself. as far as the floors go i cam gonna run braces from the frame up to the bottom of the cage mounts i think i should be ok there...if i flip it i flip it doesnt bother me and if you never see me on here again you know my idea failed

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I do think a pre-fabbed caged is a good option. If you have good welding skills, or can have the kit welded by a competent craftsman, it will be very strong. I can tell you that the S&W Racecars kit is VERY stout, but a total of 3 welding gurus

(including me) had their hands in the install. A weld is only as strong as you make it, but should be stronger than the metal. A MIG unit such as the Miller 210 that I used is ideal.

I can also tell you that I had to do a whole lot of fitting, which means notching the tubing ends, often at compound angles. Checking square, measuring, etc. This can be done with a bench or handheld grinder, but takes several hours for the whole kit. I spent several days on the roof hoop alone, as it fits in one ideal spot and the notches attach onto a bend in the main hoop. You need to take baby steps, fit the pieces, re-fit, notch some more, re-fit, etc.

This is prolly why a shop will charge $800-$1000 to fab and install a custom cage, due to the labor and time involved. But my advice is this. If you do not have the time or skill to do it properly, how much is your safety worth???

My goal is to use the Bronco for mud drag racing. I have seen way too many rollovers in the mudpits to not have a cage. Some pits have steep sides that will flip you in a heartbeat. Others are flat, but mud can make the accelerator stick. I recently saw a Blazer make a clean first run, but the second run went awry. The driver lost control and careened off to the side into the crowd. In one of my earlier career races, I made a full run but rolled the truck on it's side entering the pit area.

Racing is fun, but it's safety first. While the race tracks have rules, the street and trails do not. BE SAFE AT ALL TIMES!!!!

 

[swampthing]

yeah i have seen many roll overs to but my main reason for putting cage in is my saftey a little bit but i mostly care about the passengers. I to love mud drag racing but im also into flying thru trails at about 70 just cause it gives me a rush. I trust my welding i have been welding for 3 years now so i should be alright. And the place i was going to take my truck to isn't a normal shop its a metal yard that has a fabrication shop and they are pretty cheap thats where i get all my straps and metal. I appreciate all your opinions and if you think of anything else i can do to my bronco let me know im always up for new ideas and challenges

 

[seawalkersee]

Im not sure I understand the sandwich idea. Are you saying to weld a piece of flat to one side of the cage, and then weld another piece of flat to the bottom side that has been cut from the original cage. Then drill holes for the bolts and bolt it together sandwiching the body inbetween? I tried the link to the other site but could not figure out what the **** I was trying to find.

Chris

 

[ocalabronco]

you've got the right idea, chris. you basically weld a rectangular or square "foot" to the bottom of the hoop tube where it meets the body, then you weld a tube to the frame so that the foot welded to the frame-side tube is dead inline with the cab-side foot. then bolt the two together, sandwiching the body between

 

[Justshootme84]

That's right. Instead of cutting a hole thru the floor and running the bottom end of the cage straight to the frame, you cut the tubing off at the floor and weld a top plate onto the tubing. From below from the frame, run the tubing up to the underside of the floor and weld a plate to the tubing. Bolt the upper and lower plates together, sandwiching the floorpan between them. The key point here is to make the plates different sizes, so they do not cut the thin floor pan in an impact. That's called a "cookie-cutter" effect. My top plates are 6"x6", the bottom plates are 4"x4". Using a "slug" on the bottom plate adds more stability, too.

I would also look into mounting the seats to the cage, instead of using the stock mounting brackets and thin floorpan. I have re-welded the driver's-side brackets, the seat frame, and repaired floor cracks for too long on my 84 Bronco. I'm mounting the new seats directly to the cage through crossmember tubing.

One last thing I am doing with my cage kit is to tie it into the B-pillars where the stock seat belt anchors bolt to. This should greatly reduce the stress cracks at the rain gutters and rear quarter panel seams. I have alot of body panel movement with the hardtop removed, but already had the gutter cracks even with the top on.

THis is the stuff I'm working on at present, as I have the cage welded up and installed in the Bronco. I will post alot more pics of my install over the next few weeks. I cna only work on it on weekends or a few hours in the evening.