Real time help...standard or reverse rotation?

Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code. If you click them and make a purchase, we may earn a small commission.

flintknapper

New member
Joined
Mar 31, 2005
Messages
11
Reaction score
0
Location
East Texas
Hey guys, sorry for the question with no introduction. I searched but did not find what I needed.

I have a '70 model 1/2 cab with a Dana 30 front axle and need to do some work to it.

Are the ring and pinion standard rotation or reverse? And does anyone know if an open diff. case from an early jeep (yeah, I know I shouldn't use the J word), will interchange. Thanks in advance, and I'll make a "proper" intro. later.

 

S_bolt19

Member
Joined
Oct 8, 2004
Messages
934
Reaction score
2
Location
Colorado
I wouldnt bother with fixing the D30. It is a very light duty axle and will break if you put anything larger than a 31-33" tire on it. Even that is pressing your luck and if you regear it to anything lower than 4.10, you can almost guarantee a broken axle anytime you get into a situation where torque is on the axle. I would think about saving time, headaches and money and just get a D44 or a D60. Both are about 2x as strong and parts are more readily available and usually cheaper for them. But to answer your question, I am not 100% sure if they will interchange. I think I remember hearing somewhere that the J**p uses reverse rotation and Ford used standard rotation, but like I said, dont take my word for it.

So basically what I am saying is that you should save your dollars and get the 44 and you will be happier.

 

STLKIKN

New member
Joined
Jan 24, 2004
Messages
577
Reaction score
1
Location
Calgary Alberta
Standard rotation gear set...

72 - 01 j**ps use the same carrier as the EB.

 
Last edited by a moderator:

Bully Bob

TOP GUN
Moderator
Joined
May 23, 2004
Messages
3,844
Reaction score
12
Location
Boulder City, Nevada (Las Vegas area)
Hey guys, sorry for the question with no introduction. I searched but did not find what I needed.
I have a '70 model 1/2 cab with a Dana 30 front axle and need to do some work to it.

Are the ring and pinion standard rotation or reverse? And does anyone know if an open diff. case from an early jeep (yeah, I know I shouldn't use the J word), will interchange. Thanks in advance, and I'll make a "proper" intro. later.

20224[/snapback]

====================

I've run my open D30 with 456's & 32's for 14 yrs. in some pretty rough stuff...never a problem. :D /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

Somebody correct me if wrong but I heard a lot of folks are going back to the 30 because it's 100+ lbs. lighter.... (I'm assuming they install the stronger axles & joints priod to lockers, etc.)
clap.gif
<' />

 

Broncoholics

Broncoholics
Joined
Feb 24, 2004
Messages
1,301
Reaction score
4
Location
Washington State
Maybe with the light weight buggies. I don't see 100# saving much weight in the truck when it already is 3500#. Chromoly shafts will help so the u-joint doesn't stretch out the ears.

My buddy runs a D30, 35's with 4:56 gears. It does OK if he's easy on the gas. They do break but they are cheap axle replacement. If I was to run a D30 I'd ditch the heavy ass doors, tailgate and add a fiberglass front clip to keep weight down. :D /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

 

S_bolt19

Member
Joined
Oct 8, 2004
Messages
934
Reaction score
2
Location
Colorado
Broncoholics, the key there is that your buddy is easy on the gas.... Most people arent. I have seen quite a few guys snap D30 axles with no more torque on them than every day driving. But if you think about it, if you break your axles 2x then you might as well have bought a D44 and not worried about that problem.

Bully, you are one of the lucky few I have ever come across that has not broken an axle running treads that size and that low geared w/a D30. I had a D30 on my first EB and I shattered, literally, the R&P and sawed off all the splines on the axles. I had just got the thing and I had no idea about what would go on if I hammered it on dirt. I had 35's, 4.56 and a Detroit in it and a hypo 289. Well the combination of everything did it in, that and being 18 and just looking for speed... :D /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" /> . I took the cover off and the ring gears fell out. The biggest piece was about the size of a quarter.

I learned my lesson the hard way...young and dumb...lol

 

Bandit

BANDIT
Joined
Jan 28, 2005
Messages
138
Reaction score
0
Location
Afton,Wyoming
Hey guys, sorry for the question with no introduction. I searched but did not find what I needed.
I have a '70 model 1/2 cab with a Dana 30 front axle and need to do some work to it.

Are the ring and pinion standard rotation or reverse? And does anyone know if an open diff. case from an early jeep (yeah, I know I shouldn't use the J word), will interchange. Thanks in advance, and I'll make a "proper" intro. later.

20224[/snapback]

I would get rid of that dana 30 in a second.If you keep it all stock,its almost O.K.,30 ,s do not hold up 1/2 as well as D-44s.Theyre not that hard to find used,I think Dynatrack can build you a brand new one,even put an Ox locker or ARB in it.

 
OP
OP
F

flintknapper

New member
Joined
Mar 31, 2005
Messages
11
Reaction score
0
Location
East Texas
====================I've run my open D30 with 456's & 32's for 14 yrs. in some pretty rough stuff...never a problem. :D /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

Somebody correct me if wrong but I heard a lot of folks are going back to the 30 because it's 100+ lbs. lighter.... (I'm assuming they install the stronger axles & joints priod to lockers, etc.) /><' />

 

Seabronc

New member
Joined
May 22, 2004
Messages
7,315
Reaction score
35
Location
North of NYC
A Dana is a Dana is a Dana no matter what vehicle it is mounted on.

The term "reverse rotation" and "reverse cut" are often mistakenly interchanged. Reverse rotation refers to the direction of the front differential gear motion when driving the vehicle forward and that is the way they worked prior to 1977. The differential redesign by Dana at Fords request changed the gear cut to a reverse cut and a differential design change the alowed the gears to turn on the strong side. The old design caused the gears to rotate on the weak side thus the term "reverse rotation" for the front differential.

Something that may be of interest is the term reverse rotation, from here on I quote information from the Dynatrac Corporation in an article written by one of their engineers by the name of Jim McGean. Unfortunately the article is no longer available online. I am considering contacting Dynatrac and requesting permission to reproduce the entire document, which covers a lot more information on Axle Swapping and Building. I am only quoting a few paragraphs that apply to the "reverse rotation / reverse cut confusion".

"Reverse-cut is often mistakenly refered to as reverse rotation. this is perhaps the single most misunderstood term by 4-wheelers and even a lot of people in the axle business. A reverse cut housing is not just like a standard cut housing turned upside down. It is a specially designed housing for front drive axles. Contrary to popular belief, id does not turn backwards or in reverse. The term reverse cut actually refers to the direction of the spiral cut in the ring gear. In a reverse cut axle the spiral on the ring gear is opposite from a standard cut ring gear. The idea behind reverse cut is to strengthen the operation of the gear when it is used for front driving axle operation.

Years ago when 4 wheel drive was invented, the front axle used the same gears and housing as an ordinary rear end. This was done for economic reasons since the components were already in mass production. They simply added the necessary parts to enable steeering. However, all ring and pinion gears are cut in such a way that they are inherently stronger when pushing the vehicle in a forward direction and weaker when driving in reverse. So that means the standard cut (rear-end style) gear when used in the front, must push on the weaker side of the gear to move the vehicle in a forward direction.

This practice continued until the late 1970's when Ford asked Dana to design a new axle that would be stronger for front axle use and also provide better driveline angles for shorter front drive shafts, then being used in new trucks. Dana responded by designing a new housing and reverse cut gear set with a pinion that entered the case above the centerline of the axle. Ford used this new approach in all their 4WD vehicles built from 1977 onward. Other manufacturers didn't start using this approach until the late 80's, and many still use the same standard cut, rear-end style design for front drive axle use.

The bottom line is that reverse cut gears (front axle style) and axle assemblies are inherently stronger for front axle use because of the way the gears mesh when moving the vehicle in a forward direction. They also provide better driveline angles because the pinion is located above the centerline if the axle.

The gearset used in each axle are not interchangable. Standard cut gears cannot be used in place of reverse vcut and vice versa. The housings are also not interchangable. However differential cases, be they open,posi, or locker are compatible with both styles, as long as the spline count matches the axle shaft. So you don't have to buy a special differential for either one."

The bottom line here is that front differentials on Fords prior to 1977 used a stndard cut ring and pinion which ran in reverse rotation when the vehicle was moving forward turning the gears on the weak side. From 1977 on Ford used the "reverse cut" design and housing that allowed the rotation to be on the strong side of the gears.

And that's Dynatracs story and I'm sticking with them :D/ Hope I didn't bore ya :blush: Thought you might find that interesting. :blink:

Good luck,

:)>-

 
Last edited by a moderator:

Similar threads

T
Replies
0
Views
1K
Top stories on BroncoZone.com
T
T
Replies
0
Views
863
Top stories on BroncoZone.com
T
T
Replies
0
Views
1K
Top stories on BroncoZone.com
T

Members online

Forum statistics

Threads
22,621
Messages
136,702
Members
25,282
Latest member
79' Buckin Bronco
Top