92 Bronco ECM

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deker

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Hello All,
I have a 92 Bronco that I believe has a bad ECM.

Symptom:
Engine will stall when coming to a stop
Engine will run OK at startup, when warm runs rough when hitting the accelerate (manually through throttle) but if I go slow and it works its way to running ok.
EGR doesn't move at all but will with vac applied.

Codes given 311 and 334. The key on not running voltage at the EGR, TAD, TAB solenoids is at 9.24VDC instead of over 10.5. Resistance is less than 5 ohms to connector.

The general EEC power and ground checks failed:
EECc (60) to - Batt open
EEC (46) to DLC(1) open
EEC (46) to EEC (40) open
EEC (46) to EEC (60) open

Didn't check TPC on check 6

The caps have been replaced

Thanks
 
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i believe, IIRC the solenoids are powered on the positive side by the EEC relay and controlled by the computer on the negative side. which means between ground and one side of the EGR TAB TAD solenoids you should see battery voltage, with key in on position regardless of engine running. the other side of circuit should be grounded when the computer commands these solenoids to operate. big deal here is if the EEC power circuit which powers fuel injectors, IAC solenoid, and the afformentioned valves is not at battery voltage, this could cause these symptoms and would not be a computer issue.

if you jumper your self test connector, key on engine off, let it go thru all its codes, it will long pause, then the check engine light will illuminate on. at this point, push down the gas pedal to floor momentarily, under the hood you should hear these solenoids all engage, push again to disengauge.

find the common EEC 12v line, on one of these solenoid valve connectors while disconnected. test against bat NEG. should be very close to battery voltage. should not deviate from it by more than 0.2v
plug it in, do you hear the solenoid click on? this means the
the solenoids are in on position, or grounded by the computer. if no click when connector is plugged back in, go to the throttle and momentarily open throttle. opposite side of connector should be the sinking side, or grounding side of the circuit. test between it and bat positive, you should see within 1.5v of battery voltage. the sinking side of circuit looses a little voltage due to losses in the transistor.

if i had access to my laptop right now i'd be more helpful, with giving you actual wire colors. i'm on my phone and don't have access to an FSM.

ruling out poor voltage on your EEC relay circuit, (V+) is important. if you see 9v ish voltage, or inconsistent voltage at the solenoids, at the fuel injector connectors, at the IAC valve, between ground and the EEC relay V+, this could cause a lot of problems.

this is just one of many things to troubleshoot.

side note, if you have access to any junkyards nearby, with an eecIV computer for your engine/transmission combo, its very likely going to work just fine. in my experience, very little changed on EECIV computers besides the black/gray ignition modules and the signature PIP signal, or if you have a E4OD trans, and even at that, they work but often just set codes. you must have an E4OD computer to do that transmission. manual and C6 trans computers are nearly identical.

i tend to avoid impediance based tests, prefer voltage based testing as a very poor connection can still appear okay on a meter.

EDIT:
i have recapped these computers before, beware of the silicone gunk they put on the circuit boards, it may have prevented a good solder connection. i have done a number of them over the years and was subtly surprised to find that it didn't solve the issue, that it had nothing to do with the computer but was an overlooked thing elsewhere.

hope any of this helps. i'll try to check back in.
 
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deker

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i believe, IIRC the solenoids are powered on the positive side by the EEC relay and controlled by the computer on the negative side. which means between ground and one side of the EGR TAB TAD solenoids you should see battery voltage, with key in on position regardless of engine running. the other side of circuit should be grounded when the computer commands these solenoids to operate. big deal here is if the EEC power circuit which powers fuel injectors, IAC solenoid, and the afformentioned valves is not at battery voltage, this could cause these symptoms and would not be a computer issue.

if you jumper your self test connector, key on engine off, let it go thru all its codes, it will long pause, then the check engine light will illuminate on. at this point, push down the gas pedal to floor momentarily, under the hood you should hear these solenoids all engage, push again to disengauge.

find the common EEC 12v line, on one of these solenoid valve connectors while disconnected. test against bat NEG. should be very close to battery voltage. should not deviate from it by more than 0.2v
plug it in, do you hear the solenoid click on? this means the
the solenoids are in on position, or grounded by the computer. if no click when connector is plugged back in, go to the throttle and momentarily open throttle. opposite side of connector should be the sinking side, or grounding side of the circuit. test between it and bat positive, you should see within 1.5v of battery voltage. the sinking side of circuit looses a little voltage due to losses in the transistor.

if i had access to my laptop right now i'd be more helpful, with giving you actual wire colors. i'm on my phone and don't have access to an FSM.

ruling out poor voltage on your EEC relay circuit, (V+) is important. if you see 9v ish voltage, or inconsistent voltage at the solenoids, at the fuel injector connectors, at the IAC valve, between ground and the EEC relay V+, this could cause a lot of problems.

this is just one of many things to troubleshoot.

side note, if you have access to any junkyards nearby, with an eecIV computer for your engine/transmission combo, its very likely going to work just fine. in my experience, very little changed on EECIV computers besides the black/gray ignition modules and the signature PIP signal, or if you have a E4OD trans, and even at that, they work but often just set codes. you must have an E4OD computer to do that transmission. manual and C6 trans computers are nearly identical.

i tend to avoid impediance based tests, prefer voltage based testing as a very poor connection can still appear okay on a meter.

EDIT:
i have recapped these computers before, beware of the silicone gunk they put on the circuit boards, it may have prevented a good solder connection. i have done a number of them over the years and was subtly surprised to find that it didn't solve the issue, that it had nothing to do with the computer but was an overlooked thing elsewhere.

hope any of this helps. i'll try to check back in.
Thank you Shadetree
I will check these and post.
I did check the V+ to ground and had battery voltage.
I also pulled the EEC and believe I did not meter the correct pins as I had continuity from 46 to 40 and 46 to 60 on the bench...
As a side note there was a bit of moisture on the EEC enclosure and some wetness on the floor by the drivers door.
At our local pull a part they only have the 5.0.
 
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i have a 90 truck FSM if that would be of use to you its a monster PDF but yeah. feel free to PM me. yeah if the windshield seal is bad, water could drool down into the kickpanel and could end up in the computer. i have never personally seen it, but i could see how it could happen. i wouldn't rule out other things besides the ECM.

more info would be helpful, specifically the following:
does it run okay until computer goes into closed loop mode? (warmed up)
is the stalling inconsistent? or always happens?
how long does it take for problem to occur after a cold start?

funny, i have a bronco right now which i'm working on, it starts great, it drives on the highway great, but occasionally, only when warmed up and in closed loop, it will get stubbly and stall at light throttle, it still idles okay, but seems that when the computer goes into a 'cruising speed strategy' it just gets its fuel table too lean in the light throttle section of it. part of me thinks the OXY sensor is shot, the mechanic before me didn't know how to time the engine right and set it re.. tar.. ded like 30 degrees. the exhaust got so hot it melted the regulator off the alternator, (never seen that before) melted the plastic wheelwell and baked the starter enough it barely could turn the engine over when hot. this being on a 4.9l I6. we ended up replacing the engine due to that, but the OXY sensor is still on there from beforehand, i'm sort of suspect of it, perhaps biasing the fuel strategy too lean. its an annoying issue, as it is pretty intermittent.
 
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deker

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Between weather and work I haven't been able to do much. I am on the other side of your mountains.
I did put the ECM back in, warmed it up by idling, and it didn't stumble when giving it gas. From the engine bay I can see that the EGR was now moving with the throttle. The voltage at the EGR solenoid is still below 10.5V with KOEO. When running it showed 12V with the connector unplugged and engine running. I ran out of daylight at that point and will work on Saturday for the other checks you noted.
Will also see if I can find the source of the water coming in.
Thank you for your help
 

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