351w starting problems (weird)

[wolf83]

i measured everything... here are the dimensions ...

starter cone - 4 1/8 in diameter

hole for starter cone - 4 1/8 in diamter

width of starter teeth - 3/8 in (front to back - not tip to valley)

width of flexplate teeth - 3/8 in (front to back - not tip to valley)

flexplate teeth are 1 1/2 in from driver side edge of hole to tip of teeth (1 1/4 in to valley of teeth)

flexplate is 1/2 in from front of tans

starter teeth can travel along its shaft an additional 1 1/4 in.

i wonder if the starter's cone is too long. it might be completely missing the ring gear.

also, i threaded one of the bolts that holds the starter all the way into its place, and it wiggles a bit. i might also have the wrong size bolt.

is it US or metric?

W.

 

[wolf83]

If your starter was installed properly you should be ble to pry all day long with no result except maybe a dented oilpan. I would climb under and have a look to be certain the starter is fully seated into place. Make sure the starter bolts are tight. Also wouldnt hurt to pull the inspection cover to inspect the flexplate, make sure the teath are intact all the way around

the more i sit and ponder this, the more convinced i am that the starter is being secured with the wrong type/size of bolt. i have attached some pics.

notice the hole on the side of the starter through which the bolt goes... it's too large.

the diagram on the side of the starter shows a bolt with an un-threaded shaft nead the head of the bolt, but my bolt is threaded all the way to the head.

the third pic shows the markings on the bolt head.

when i thread the bolt into the hole for it in the bell housing, it wiggles just slightly. it threads nice and easily, which makes me think the threads-per-inch count is right, but the fact that it wiggles makes me think it can loosen on its own. and since the hole for the bolt on the starter is too large to begin with, then i think the starter is wiggling itself loose -- which might give it just enough wiggle-room to not engage the ring gear.

i am going to go to the hardware store and buy a bolt with an unthreaded shaft -- just like the diagram -- and see if that solves my problem.

 

[Jimmy Neutron]

How much are you twisting on your wrench to tighten down the starter?

How are you coming along with the identification of the correct starter?

The flexplate looks really good!! Thanks for the pictures.

I believe your perception of the hardware is correct!!

I am no bolt expert, but from what I am seeing from the pictures, you should have a 3/8" bolt with 16 threads per inch that is no shorter than 1.5". That means it is supposed to be standard!!

~But I have been wrong before... and will most likely be wrong again!!

 

[wolf83]

How much are you twisting on your wrench to tighten down the starter?
How are you coming along with the identification of the correct starter?

The flexplate looks really good!! Thanks for the pictures.

I believe your perception of the hardware is correct!!

I am no bolt expert, but from what I am seeing from the pictures, you should have a 3/8" bolt with 16 threads per inch that is no shorter than 1.5". That means it is supposed to be standard!!

~But I have been wrong before... and will most likely be wrong again!!

i twist it as tight as i can. i figure it's an important part that's near the motor, so it should be torqued down pretty hard.

the diagram is on the starter, and the threaded hole is in the bell housing. the starter's holes are not threaded. there are 2 metric bolts in there now. i think what i need are bolts that don't have threads near the head of the bolt -- or maybe a sleeve to fit over the bolts to take up space and keep the bolts centered in the hole.

to test this idea, i put 4 zip ties on the starter -- 2 in each hole -- to see if cantering the bolts and being able to keep them tight would ensure that the starter makes contact with the ring gear every time. see pic. so far it has worked. i can restart it every time i try now.

when i get to town i'll find me some bolts, or sleeves or both.

W.

edit: spelling... (i know how to spell, i just have fat fingers)

 

[Jimmy Neutron]

Also remember that if the bolts are too small (sloppy in threaded hole as you stated) this would allow too much play and the starter to slip over out of the flexplate. You may need nothing more than the right bolt size!

This would be too cool if all this needed to get running is a few dollars worth of bolts!!

 

[wolf83]

Also remember that if the bolts are too small (sloppy in threaded hole as you stated) this would allow too much play and the starter to slip over out of the flexplate. You may need nothing more than the right bolt size!
This would be too cool if all this needed to get running is a few dollars worth of bolts!!

exactly! i've been pumped about it since i found it on craigslist.

of course, it's not without its problems.

(1) the lower power steering seal is out -- easy fix.

(2) it leaks quite a bit of oil -- it slowly drips down from the place where the oil pan and the bell housing meet. not sure where to start on this one.

(3) exhaust leak, making it loud from the driver side. what's that thing attached to the exhaust manifold? whatever it is, i think it's broken.

(4) air conditioner is not properly hooked up. it needs a belt, but that might be all it needs.

(5) the coil is not attached to the engine, and i have no idea where it should be attached.

(6) the small wire that comes from the coil has been taped off (see pic)

(7) and a few more strange odds and ends... :blink: :wacko:

my next step is to fix #1, because it keeps me from driving it. but then i'll move into #3, since i am concerned about it the most.

 

[Jimmy Neutron]

(1) the lower power steering seal is out -- easy fix.

-Easy, as long as you have a pitman arm puller...

(2) it leaks quite a bit of oil -- it slowly drips down from the place where the oil pan and the bell housing meet. not sure where to start on this one.

-This could be a rear main seal or just a leaky oil pan gasket. Let's pray for the oil pan gasket!!

(3) exhaust leak, making it loud from the driver side. what's that thing attached to the exhaust manifold? whatever it is, i think it's broken.

-It could be the EGR tube. Did I miss the picture of that?? If it is, the EGR is just for emissions... I know a few that have just pinched it off and JB Welded it shut.

(4) air conditioner is not properly hooked up. it needs a belt, but that might be all it needs.

-Then again, it could be unhooked because it stopped working...

(5) the coil is not attached to the engine, and i have no idea where it should be attached.

-You can reattach it anywhere you please. Just be sure to avoid moving parts and that wires do not get caught your belt system.

(6) the small wire that comes from the coil has been taped off (see pic)

-I am not sure where this wire was once supposed to go...