Water Pump/Timing Chain/PS Swap

[chuckles1856]

Greetings,

'91 Bronco 5.8L has had a p/s leak for a while and recently seems to have sprung a coolant leak around the timing chain cover. Got 190K on her so I suppose it's about time to have to replace this stuff.

Anyway, figured I'd do the Saginaw swap so I pulled a pump and bracket off an e-van in the junk yard. Anyone know where to get a cap for the sag pump? Seems those are real hot items cause hardly any pumps had caps on them in the yard.

While I was pulling off the water pump noticed the bolts were not looking too good. Is there a place I can get a bolt set for the water pump?

Now I'm down to the timing chain cover. There's a bracket that holds the smog pump on. Seems like you have to take it off to get the cover off. Any good ideas on getting that bolt off? It tighter than all get out and next to no room to get some leverage. I almost stripped the head trying to get it off. Sprayed some liquid wrench type stuff so I'll see if it makes a difference.

In the mean time I'm all ears.

 

[miesk5]

yo C!

WP Bolts; Get ARP-bolts.com locally from varous parts stores; some Ford dealers carry them too

Black GM Ford Mopar Saginaw Power Steering Pump Cap

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Black-GM-Ford-Mopar-Saginaw-Power-Steering-Pump-Cap-/300752274532

Dorman Products (HELP! Brand) has many Power Steering Caps; need to sort thru their messed up catalog to find it though.

http://www.dormanproducts.com/c-555-power-steering-caps.aspx

This is by Rick

For some reason my pump hangs from just one upper 9/16" (head size) bolt (right under the alty bracket), and there is no lower bolt used. Instead, the pressure from the idler pulley/tensioner pulls the body of the pump towards the center of the motor where it sits against the bolt from the timing mark indicator. Very strange. Anyways, to get started you'll need 5/16" nut driver or a flat tipped screwdriver to remove the 2 hose clamps. My hoses slipped right off with just a little bit of twisting. Now get a 3/8" ratchet and a short 6 point 10mm socket to crack the three small bolts on the front of the pulley. Loosen these 3/4 of a turn and then put your large crescent wrench on the tensioner bolt to remove the fan belt. When the belt is off you can then remove pulley and then the upper bolt, finally lowering the pump down with one hand.

(I started to remove the bolt here before I realized that the pulley needed to come off first, due to the fact that it's about 5" long).

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/astodder/Broncosmogpump1-1209001.jpg

Here's a pic of how my pump could swing left and right after the bolt was loosened a bit. You should be able to see the bolt/stud by the timing mark that keeps the pump in place. Personally I think this is not a good thing because with only one bolt holding it on there's some slop that can allow the pump to twist off centered a bit. Bad for the bearings methinks.

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/astodder/Broncosmogpump1-1209008.jpg

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/astodder/Broncosmogpump1-1209006-1.jpg

 

[chuckles1856]

Miesk5 -- For some reason I figured you'd be first to reply!

Thanks for the info on those bolts and pump cap. They will come in real handy when I get back to that point. ;-)

Also, wanted to thank you for the post on loosening the bolt which holds on the harmonic balancer. I almost kicked myself for not thinking of wedging the socket wrench and turning the engine. It worked like a champ!

In regards to the smog pump and timing chain cover I'll have to take a picture as it seems I have a slightly different set up. Rick's smog pump seems closer to the timing chain cover. Mine has a bracket that hold the smog pump to the timing chain cover. There is a stud that comes out the back side of the smog pump with the tighter than ****, no room to move nut. ;-)

While we wait on a picture ....you have any suggestions on a type of timing chain/sprockets and harmonic balancer? I see a bunch out there but I didn't know if it really matters all that much. Bone stock replacements or performance parts? I'd love to burn the socks off the guy in Porsche but realistically I'm just using the Bronco for the heavy jobs that won't fit in the grocery getter ( and an occasional doughnut in the snow covered parking lot or off-road hill climb to impress my kids).

 

[miesk5]

yo C,

I prefer Ford Motorcraft parts

Stock is pref over "performance" parts, esp those that are slightly off a bit in dimensions

get Ford part number

and then google for best $

then ask local parts houses to beat or match price

get my Ford parts via AMAZON; they are VG at delvy and esp pricing; I bought a $150.00 DPFE Sensor for $50.00 with free shipping and no sales tax

http://www.fordparts.com/Commerce/CatalogResults.aspx?y=1991&m=Ford&mo=Bronco#Search

View Image



6268 Engine Timing Chain 5.8L; Dual roller chain $32.87

&

6256

Engine Timing Camshaft Gear 5.8L; Dual tooth gear-Use only with EOAZ6268-A & EOAZ6306-A $44.73

 

[chuckles1856]

As promised, a couple of pics of the timing chain cover-bracket-smog pump.

I was able to free the bolt (thought it was a nut) on the smog pump using a long handle ratchet and some extensions as the frame had a hole in it where I could gain some more leverage. Still a pain in the neck.

Got the timing chain cover off. Lot of slack in that old chain. Guess it would be a good time to replace it.

Scraped the old gasket off. And inspecting the timing chain cover around the coolant/water inlets it looks kind of pitted. Let's just say not the smoothest of surfaces. I probably need some pictures but thoughts on replacing the timing chain cover?

 

[miesk5]

yo C,

Timing Chain Cover Removal Video in a 94 Part 1; MIESK5 Note, Suggest Right Clicking this Hot Link & Open in New Window

Source: by theoldbroncokid at youtube.com

Replacement in an 86 5.0

Source: by Sixlitre (Malcolm H, Eddie Bauer) at http://www.supermotors.net/registry/4970/18193

Replacement in a 92 5.8 w/Many Tips; "...Tips by Sackman: Once the timing cover is removed, stuff rags down into the oil pan to keep debris from gasket material from falling in before you start scraping. Before you remove the rags, use a shop vac to **** the gasket material up. You don't want any to make their way into the oil pump. Your gonna need a harmonic balancer remover tool. Getting the front bolt out can be tricky. My method is to put the 15/16 socket and ratchet on the bolt. Have a pipe handy and position the ratchet on the drivers side to unloosen. Slip pipe onto the ratchet and rest it on the floor. Then just bump the starter. The bolt will then be loose. Make sure to remove the washer as well that's with the bolt. Not doing so, and you'll break the balancer. Drain the oil, and leave the plug out in case coolant makes it way into the pan, it'll come out. Don't worry about the timing marks for this job either. Not a big deal. Just take everything apart. As long as you get the lineup of the chain correctly, and didn't disturb the distributor, those timing marks mean nothing for this job. Inspect coolant ports of timing cover for corrosion. Specially the part that meet the engine block.

Tips by Tony R; I did this a week ago. Timing chain/gears and water pump. You have to remove the balancer to get the timing cover off. Getting the timing marks to TDC aligns the timing chain marks and gears so when you reinstall, your cam and distributor are still in line. There are two dots on the gears as he mentions. When the #1 piston is TDC, the dots should align closest to each other. If they are a 180 degress off, you have to rotate the motor to get them aligned. Once this is done, remove the bolt holding the larger gear on and the whole set should pull forward. They have to come off parallel. You will see when you remove them. I bought a new set from NAPA. The are Cloyes gears, which is a better brand. It was less than $50 for the set. I have a 150K miles on the motor and there was enough slop in the chain to warrant repalcement. If you do replace the timing set, when you try to get them back on the crank and camshafts, it will feel like the chain is too short and will not fit. This is where you have to get the two gears in line and pull the chain as tight as you can. It will then go on. You have to push both gears in at the same time as the tension on the chain will make it difficult. Unfortunatelly I did not take pics, but six's write up is very good! The one gasket that does not come in the kits is the one that goes between the thin metal plate and the water pump. I bought a timing cover gasket set and it had all of them but this one.. $.97 at the auto parts store. Just check. It stopped me for a 1/2 hour to go get one..." Source: by 2bet

 

[miesk5]

yo C,

BTW

Saginaw reservoir extension $25.00 shipped from FL



by 1TonF100

@ http://www.supermotors.net/registry/media/866406

Look for it on the www

 

[chuckles1856]

In regards to the Saginaw extension... well at least I know why there was no cap on the one I pulled ;-) Maybe I'll find the extension scattered around the F-Van I pulled it out of ( just wishful thinking ).

Talking about the Sag pump. I noticed on the F-Van the lines went straight into the steering gearbox however with the stock p/s on my Bronco one side of the lines snake around the cross member/axle for cooling purposes I imagine. Is that diversion necessary with the Sag pump or can you just bolt up the lines to the gearbox as in the E-Van configuration.

In other developments... I removed the timing chain and gears last night. The bolt holding the bigger gear was not torqued very tight. And I'm trying to decide if I want to try and replace the oil pan gasket or just chop it and use the gaskets with the timing chain cover gaskets?

 

[chuckles1856]

Thought I'd share the pulling of the shaft seal out of the timing chain cover.

I tried to pound it out and then tried to push it out with c-clamp to no avail. I saw there was a tool for this so I figured I'd try it. As I stood on the cover so it wouldn't move, I used the tool but it wouldn't budge. I grabbed a pipe to get some more leverage and ended up twisting the handle on the tool so I ended up sliding the pipe over the entire handle ( so much for that extra leverage). After giving it a 1-2-3 heave-** I thought it had come out but all I managed to do was bend one of the hooks. So, I tried the other hook for one last attempt and the seal popped out! As I looked down at the tool I discovered I now had bent the other hook.

Inscription on tool says to resharpen hooks if they dull. It should say to bend them back in place after use. ;-)

Scrubbed up the cover with some brake cleaner and washed it shiny with some Simple Green and water.

 

[miesk5]

yo,

Isn't it great wrecking tools and causing mayhem, cursing, bleeding, but finally get er' done?

I had a Lisle puller that had no handle; used w/3/8 drive breaker bar.

Instructions were; Simply insert hook behind seal and pull. lol

Well, you saved more $$$ by DIY!

 

[chuckles1856]

About got everything back together after more blood, sweat and tears.

Need to fill and change the fluids oil,p/s fluid and coolant.

Need to find a bigger surpentine belt.

Some tips:

1) When putting the timing chain cover on I ran into an issue where the harmonic balancer would not fit due to the "timing pointer" being in the way.

Had to take off the pointer, 2 bolts that hold the timing cover on, and then put the harmonic balancer on, and then put the pointer back on.

2) The crankshaft seal was getting twisted while pushing the harmonic balancer on. It was a real PITA to get it on right. I think it might have been that way because of the sleeve I put on the balancer due to it being worn.

3) Took out the A/C. It is true that the whole A/C unit comes out. The big trick is the box where the evaporator is at. There is once bolt which holds the cover together which must be removed from the inside of the truck. It's on the passenger side and goes through the firewall.

4) In order to take the bracket off the smog pump I needed a 1/2" deep socket, an extender (2"), and the socket wrench. I had to come from behind the smog pump and put the wrench through a hole in the frame. I've attached a pic of the tools and the bolt.

5) I had to bend the high pressure line coming off the saginaw pump in order to get it to fit in the steering box. And the the bolts that attached the p/s bracket to the engine block seem to match up just fine, but the other hole which attaches to a stud from the water pump doesn't line up

perfectly. Functionally I don't think it really matters.

Questions:

1) Swapping the stock air box with a K&N filter RF-1012 (I believe). Instructions I found seem pretty strait forward; however, the 3" pipe/conduit doesn't fit in the air filter. You need the pipe as a link between the stock air tubes and the K&N filter. While at the hardware store looking for something suitable to use I found a 2 1/2" pipe which seems to be the closest but it's still not snug. Any ideas here?

 

[miesk5]

yo C,

THANKS for the TIPS!

===

re; "...) Swapping the stock air box with a K&N filter RF-1012 (I believe). Instructions I found seem pretty strait forward; however, the 3" pipe/conduit doesn't fit in the air filter. You need the pipe as a link between the stock air tubes and the K&N filter. While at the hardware store looking for something suitable to use I found a 2 1/2" pipe which seems to be the closest but it's still not snug..."

Some use rubber couplers and hose clamps off of ebay; along with a 3" tube

Here are some K&N® pics in a 90 5.8

Source: by Cam C (BlancoBronco, Project BLANCO) http://www.supermotors.net/registry/5331/21535

 

[chuckles1856]

Went to the auto parts store and found some 3" exhaust pipe. It fit perfectly in the K&N, although the stock air intake tube seems a little bigger diameter.

I hacked off 2 sections of about 3" to 4" in length. Put it all together and fired up the Bronco.

It was running great with no leaks.

Took it around the block. Had pretty good pickup but then again it had been a few months since I stepped on the gas in a V8, being constrained to the 6 cylinder variety.

Got back and popped the hood to notice coolant all over the place. Fortunately it just looks like the heater hose coming off the water pump.

Should have replaced it when I had everything tore down. ;-(

 

[chuckles1856]

I stripped out the A/C ( cause it didn't work and I never use it) while fixing the other stuff....defrost is working inside the cab but doesn't switch to floor or vent.... seems like a vacuum hose isn't hooked up somewhere.

Is there something I'm missing here?

 

[miesk5]

yo,

Yes, see this HVAC vacuum Diagram Source: by Chris B (Blue, bronco boy) at http://chrisb.users.superford.org/Bronco/Misc/1986_EVTSM_Page_141.jpg

Also ck Floor Defrost Door & its Vacuum "Motor"

 

[chuckles1856]

Miesk5,

Thanks for the quick response! No time to troubleshoot the venting yet.

Got another problem. Sag pump is whining like it's out of fluid.

This morning while in park I turned the wheels to stress the pump while depressing the accelerator.

Pump making a lot of whining noise....started smelling p/s fluid....looks like fluid was coming from under the cap spilling all over the place.

What gives here?

Pump not working?

Too much fluid?

Not sure if the cap is the right cap as the pump didn't have one on it at the yard.

Also, not seeing much performance with this "new" pump. Others who have made the swap swear by it. Maybe mine is defective.

 

[miesk5]

yo C,

Whine Type Noise

Aerated fluid or cam contour damaged.

Worn or damaged valve O-ring seal.

PURGE system of air.

Fill power steering oil reservoir.

Operate engine until it reaches normal operating temperature.

Turn steering wheel to the left and right several times without hitting stops.

CAUTION: Do not hold steering wheel in the far left or right position, or damage to power steering pump may result.

Recheck fluid level inpower steering oil reservoir and fill if required.

Check lines for kinks or obstructions

If condition not resolved, REPLACE pump.

GO to Pinpoint Test D.

Ford uses its Power Steering Analyzer for the Part D tests that consiste of tests for;

flow rate & flow rate return

pressure

 

[chuckles1856]

Cool...it didn't make as much noise this morning. Filled the tires to the proper pressure. I think after sitting most of the summer they could use some air. ;-)

So if I'm reading correctly ...purging the system of air means turning the wheel from the left and right then refilling with fluid if needed?

 

[miesk5]

Cool...it didn't make as much noise this morning. Filled the tires to the proper pressure. I think after sitting most of the summer they could use some air. ;-)

So if I'm reading correctly ...purging the system of air means turning the wheel from the left and right then refilling with fluid if needed?

yo C,

Correct;

Heat engine to norm op temp

turn engine off

then fill pump to correct dipstick level

start engine

Turn steering wheel to the left and right several times without hitting stops.

turn engine off

then fill pump to correct dipstick level if needed