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Tailgate Window Issues on a 1988


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#1 NaturalRampage

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Posted 11 May 2011 - 06:39 PM

Hey guys, Im new to the site and its great to see some sweet Broncos out there, I'll post mine up tomorrow on the introduction page when theres light outside.

My problem right now is that im struggling as to how to remove the safety device on my truck so I can operate the window to the tailgate. The motor works fine, but its that little device thats causing me problems and I dont really know how to disconnect it without breaking it. It looks like as if its attached to the tailgate but I only see part of it with a mirror. Once I have it disconnected, I'm planning on jumping the wires to have the truck think the tailgate is up.

Let me know if theres anything else you guys need to know to help me fix this. Thank you!
1988 Ford Bronco Full Size XLT. 5.0L 302 Engine EFI. AOD Transmission. 33 inch Tires. 4 inch Lift.

#2 miesk5

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 02:33 AM

yo'

Welcome to the Zone!

It is the Latch Safety Switch
here is a pic by Steve83
Posted Image
He wrote;
"This is the switch on the driver's latch that prevents the motor from operating with the tailgate open. Ford put it here from ~'85 until '96. Before that, it was on the center mechanism and was sensitive to EITHER latch being open.

To permanently defeat it (and risk breaking the t/g glass), unplug its connector & install a jumper wire between the 2 sockets..."

============

Try pushing on the tailgate in while holding the button or key switch in the up or down position.

Push the glass up; use leather covered gloves; I saw a pal use a toilet plunger on the glass to inch it up;


or "...If the glass is clear of the shell, but you can't open the t/g, remove the inside access panel & pull these 2 rods inward. Either unclip them from the center mechanism, or pull them like bow strings to release each latch. Make sure the glass isnt so high that it engages the campers groove, or it could break. If it wont come down, unbolt the slides from the glass, or the motor from the regulator to lower the glass..."
Posted Image
Source: by Steve83

after 82, there are 2 seperate power sources & 2 fuses/circuit breakers for positive. 1 for each switch. The same 2 wires are used throughout for both up & down (Polarity is reversed by the switches). When the tailgate is open, you have to close the driver's side latch for the window to operate. Remember to open it before closing the tailgate.


the motor's turning, but the window doesn't move? If so, there are torque pins in the motor's drive gear that commonly break & aren't too bad to replace. See the torque pin, Steve83's & Adrianspeeder's links in my site @ http://www.broncolin...x.php?index=478
--

after you get the TG open;
make sure the tailgate is resting DOWN fully (horizontally) by pushing or sitting on it before pulling glass out by hand (or closing driver side Latch by hand and using Key sw or driver's Dash switch to energize motor) because the TG's Support cables need to fully stretched.
I use a standard height saw horse with a blanket folded to support da glass & sliding saw horse under da glass. T
o extend the glass, I close the driver's side latch's jaws on side of tailgate
I use a screw driver to close the jaws, so that the glass can be moved by TG Key Switch or Dash Switch to work on internals; when done & window is retracted within the TG, use the Handle to release the jaws & close the TG

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#3 NaturalRampage

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 01:03 PM

Heya, I should've mentioned some parts that I forgot, such as I can get the window down by taking a 12V battery to the motor and it works perfectly fine. The tailgate opens great and everything. But my problem is that when I try to use the button on my dashboard or the keyhole on the tailgate to get the window down, it just wont go. Im currently trying to disconnect the Latch Safety switch but it wont budge. I try to wiggle the wires back and forth in hope of it popping right out but its still in there and I was wondering if there is some kind of clip on it thats preventing me from pulling it out.

Really appreciate the response and the information, but most of the tailgate is working properly. Let me know if theres more info you need to help me out with this.
1988 Ford Bronco Full Size XLT. 5.0L 302 Engine EFI. AOD Transmission. 33 inch Tires. 4 inch Lift.

#4 Rons beast

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 07:35 PM

Sounds like you are using a battery to overide the switches. Will the window go up with the switches? Or is it not working at all?
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#5 Seabronc

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Posted 13 May 2011 - 03:07 AM

Heya, I should've mentioned some parts that I forgot, such as I can get the window down by taking a 12V battery to the motor and it works perfectly fine. The tailgate opens great and everything. But my problem is that when I try to use the button on my dashboard or the keyhole on the tailgate to get the window down, it just wont go. Im currently trying to disconnect the Latch Safety switch but it wont budge. I try to wiggle the wires back and forth in hope of it popping right out but its still in there and I was wondering if there is some kind of clip on it thats preventing me from pulling it out.

Really appreciate the response and the information, but most of the tailgate is working properly. Let me know if theres more info you need to help me out with this.


Those connectors are a little difficult to get apart, but since you plan on bypassing it, you can just clip the wires and wire nut them together and then make sure they are tucked out of the way of the window.

That switch is a common failure but I have also seen the connector to the motor fail due to corrosion. It worked when jumped but not when the plugs were connected together. You can determine that by using a volt meter at the plug and check for 12V when the tail gate switch or dash switch is operated.

Good luck,

:)>-
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#6 NaturalRampage

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Posted 13 May 2011 - 07:00 AM

Sounds like you are using a battery to overide the switches. Will the window go up with the switches? Or is it not working at all?


As of right now the switches wont work because the truck thinks the tailgate is down. I checked the wires in the tailgate and everything seems to be in good condition. And yes when I do need the tailgate down I use a battery to jump the motor. So I figured out that its gotta be the Safety latch thats causing problems.
1988 Ford Bronco Full Size XLT. 5.0L 302 Engine EFI. AOD Transmission. 33 inch Tires. 4 inch Lift.

#7 NaturalRampage

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Posted 13 May 2011 - 07:03 AM

Those connectors are a little difficult to get apart, but since you plan on bypassing it, you can just clip the wires and wire nut them together and then make sure they are tucked out of the way of the window.

That switch is a common failure but I have also seen the connector to the motor fail due to corrosion. It worked when jumped but not when the plugs were connected together. You can determine that by using a volt meter at the plug and check for 12V when the tail gate switch or dash switch is operated.

Good luck,

:)>-


I'll try to cut them and crimp them together since I cant just unplug the device itself. But hey as long as it works then im cool with it. Thanks for the help! I'll let ya know when I get it working!
1988 Ford Bronco Full Size XLT. 5.0L 302 Engine EFI. AOD Transmission. 33 inch Tires. 4 inch Lift.

#8 NaturalRampage

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Posted 03 June 2011 - 06:49 PM

Heya sorry for the late response but heres my results so far. Its still not working.
I clipped the wires from the safety device and wire nut them together. When that failed I checked the fuse for it to make sure its working and it is. So tomorrow Im gonna take the volt meter and test the tailgate and the dashboard to see where the problem is.
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#9 Seabronc

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Posted 04 June 2011 - 03:08 AM

Here is a diagram to help you troubleshoot the problem. Note the ground return is through the driver switch so the problem can be anything from a broken switch, corroded connector, or broken wire, (a common place for broken wires is where the flex right next to the tail gate). Corrosion in the connector at the rear left side of the tub support and the firewall connector. The ground is under the dash and the driver switch must be in the neutral position for the tailgate switch to work.

Good luck,

Posted Image

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1992  Power Window 002.jpg

Fred

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Broncos are MPVs not SUVs

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#10 NaturalRampage

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Posted 13 July 2011 - 04:57 PM

Heya, heres another update.

My dad and I looked at the tailgate and checked almost everything. We took the volt meter and tested the tailgate and the dashboard switch to see if its getting power, and it is. What my dad thought was that there was corrosion on the connector from the harness in the tailgate to the motor. So we clipped it off and crimped them together. This was a 50/50 success. Meaning the tailgate works by only going up and its from the key switch in the tailgate and nothing else. We're completely stumped as to how only the up button is working and not the down button as well. We checked the wires coming from the left taillight to the tailgate to see if there is any damage done to them, which there isn't.

We've spent weeks looking at this and cant figure it out. Im so close to losing my patience that I will just run a separate wire from the battery to the dashboard switch, then to the tailgate to the wires connected to the motor (the one that we clipped and crimped) and have it reversed so the dashboard switch can only work by going down.

Any info will be really helpful. And i'll try my best to give you the information you need to help diagnose this issue. Thank you!
1988 Ford Bronco Full Size XLT. 5.0L 302 Engine EFI. AOD Transmission. 33 inch Tires. 4 inch Lift.

#11 Seabronc

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Posted 13 July 2011 - 06:30 PM

Looking at the diagram, I'd say that there is a break or bad connection in the pink with light green stripe wire. Probably in the connector that is on the left rear cross member, (look under the bumper). OR you may have a bad dash switch. click on the thumbnail and then save the picture to your computer to print and have with you when working on the problem. NOTE, that there are two fuses, one for the tail gate switch and one for the Dash switch.

Good luck,

Posted Image
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Broncos are MPVs not SUVs

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#12 nelbur

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Posted 14 July 2011 - 07:20 AM

Before you give up, unwrap the wire bundle where it goes from the tailgate into the quarter panel, and check for broken wires. On my truck the twisting from opening and closing the tailgate for 20+ years broke one of the wires. An easy fix once I figured it out, but I seriously thought about selling the truck as I struggled to figure the problem out.
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#13 Elmo

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Posted 14 July 2011 - 07:21 PM

Mine has shown the same problem at times. So far it has always been the contacts inside the dash switch. with a little bending i have always been able to get them back to working. A new switch would fix my problem.

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#14 comando4x4

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Posted 15 July 2011 - 11:51 PM

Natural Rampage:
to disconect the latch switch(what you call a safety device) you have to tug really hard on the connector(maybe even use some pliers) because its stubborn,but it doesn't have any safety latches (be careful so you don't break it). and once you do it, it's screwed onto the drivers side TG latch, so just unscrew it and you have it in your hands. I have the same problem as Natural Rampage on my '88 Bronco, I already tried 2 junkyard TG harnesses, on one of them the switch had only one side good and the other didn't work, but the main culprit was the original latch switch, I have one working from one of the junkyd harnesses, but it's broken on the threaded part, and with that and one of the junkyd harnesses I made the glass go up and down. I'll try to fix the broken part or buy a new one but haven't found any for sale on any parts store. tomorrow I'm gonna call the dealer to see if they have it and how much.

By the way, does anybody know where to buy that little plastic latch switch besides the dealership, because I'm almost sure it's gonna be costly there.


good luck

#15 Bronco Kid!

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Posted 26 August 2011 - 01:08 PM

hey first post here, im curious if you have tryed taking you dash switch apart but leaving it pluged in and using a screwdriver on the terminals, i had simillar issues with my tail gate, my dash switch would only move the window up but not down so i had to use a screwdriver to see if the switch was bad.. glad i figured that part out because now my window only goes down about 1/2 an inch. so guess i will try to find out how to jump the motor ive read alot about that just dont know where to tap into it at..

#16 miesk5

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Posted 27 August 2011 - 04:26 AM

hey first post here, im curious if you have tryed taking you dash switch apart but leaving it pluged in and using a screwdriver on the terminals, i had simillar issues with my tail gate, my dash switch would only move the window up but not down so i had to use a screwdriver to see if the switch was bad.. glad i figured that part out because now my window only goes down about 1/2 an inch. so guess i will try to find out how to jump the motor ive read alot about that just dont know where to tap into it at..


yo BK, WELCOME!
Motor Replacement; "...If the motor runs but doesn't move the glass, push the glass up for access. The glass is strong enough to support its own weight fully extended, but no extra weight..." miesk5 note, I use a standard height saw horse with a blanket folded to support da glass.. make sure the tailgate is resting DOWN fully (horizontally) by pushing or sitting on it before pulling glass out by hand (or closing driver side Latch by hand and using Key sw or driver's Dash switch to energize motor) and sliding saw horse under da glass...the cables need to fully stretched...& in his #7; "If the motor doesn't run, remove the 4 nuts (2 on each side - see below) that hold the regulator tracks to the glass brackets. Bend the regulator arms down slightly to pull the studs out of the brackets, and then push the glass up. Remember to FULLY lower the glass before lifting or closing the t/g..."
Source: by Steve83 (Steve, That dirty old truck) at http://www.supermoto...stry/2742/12689

after going thru his TG tech pics to open access panel & remove glass, etc.

see these pics, click to Enlarge;
Posted Image
"...To access the motor, remove these 3 bolts with an 8mm or 5/16" socket. If the glass has already been removed, the regulator's spring can snap the arms & gears, so be careful.."
Posted Image
"To get enough slack in the wire to pull the motor out & work on it, remove the clip from the bottom of the tailgate. Remember to reinstall it later, or the wire could become entangled in the glass or regulator.
That hook on the L side is the bottom of the interlock rod, but it's disconnected at the top & laid over to the side right now. Normally, its long section would point straight at that hole in the background..."

=========

Motor Replacement in a 90; "...Another discovery I made was the lack of threads in the mounting holes of my replacement motor. I suspect most aftermarket replacement motors do not have threads. I made the decision to put threads in the holes rather than fight with nuts (once you've found what fun it is to remove one of these motor, you'll agree). I used a 12-24 N.C. tap to match the threads to the original bolts..."
Source: by Mud E1 (Brent R) at bejara.com via web.archive
SLOW to LOAD since it is archived; see site for pics

"...STEP 1: Remove the access panel on the inside of the tailgate. Note: If your motor is not operational, then you will have to do this while sitting inside the vehicle. I was able to use my motor, which was working intermittently, to get this picture. You will, however, need to be inside the vehicle with the tailgate closed to perform the following steps. DO NOT roll the window up while the tailgate is down as the window may break without proper support. FYI: The motor is located between the tailgate latch release handle and the outer sheet metal skin, approximately in the vicinity of the lightened area of this picture. STEP 2: With the window in the up position, place something solid to support it. Once you have the motor out of the door, this support will be the only thing keeping the window up. (Note to self: clean the dirt out of the inside of here some day).

STEP 3: Disconnect the wiring harness that runs to the motor. Because of the location of the wiring harness connectors and position locks, I was not able to capture this step with my camera. The harness runs behind the regulator to the bottom of the tailgate, then back up the inside of the inner sheet metal skin where it can be disconnected.

STEP 4: Locate the three bolts that hold the motor in place. Use a 5/16" socket (1/4" drive) to remove them and the motor. Be patient as you may learn valuable skills as a contortionist during this process.

STEP 5: Be sure the replacement motor is the correct one and that the wiring harness is compatible. For reference, I took photos of the original motor (left) and replacement motor (right) identification numbers. FYI: The replacement motor is identical to the one used for the right side door (if so equipped).

STEP 5.1: As I discovered, the harness lead on my replacement motor was too short. Do not make the mistake of simply hooking a shorter harness lead to the vehicle's harness. This mistake may not appear to be a problem until you try to roll the window down and discover that the harness needs to reach all the way under the window at ALL times. I simply spliced the old harness into the new harness and used heat shrink to keep the union water proof. I also recommend testing the motor before bolting it back into place to be sure the connections are good.

STEP 5.2: Another discovery I made was the lack of threads in the mounting holes of my replacement motor. I suspect most aftermarket replacement motors do not have threads. I made the decision to put threads in the holes rather than fight with nuts (once you've found what fun it is to remove one of these motor, you'll agree). I used a 12-24 N.C. tap to match the threads to the original bolts.

STEP 6: Lube the gear on the replacement motor that powers the regulator. It's also not a bad idea to lube up the moving joints in the regulator to help reduce resistance, which both maximizes speed of operation and minimizes work load on the replacement motor.

STEP 7: Bolt the replacement motor into place. This step will probably be the most difficult as it is not easy to line up the motor with the regulator and start the bolts while trying to keep an eye on what your doing. But if I can do it so can you.

STEP 8: Remove the temporary window support.

STEP 9: Secure the wiring harness into place using the factory position locks. Note: I recommend testing the operation of the motor with the key or dash switch before going further in case something is not right.

STEP 10: Replace the tailgate access panel.
==============


Next time it would be better to Write your Q in a new post so we don't get years and issues mixed-up..I'm getting like a Dino now and forget thAngs, like where are my keys!"

in my archived BRONCO TECHNICAL

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Thanks to All Who Serve


#17 Bronco Kid!

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Posted 27 August 2011 - 04:24 PM

so just got my motor out and tested it and its good... then i tried to drop the window and i can only get it to go down about 1 inch with motor disconnected.. so my next move is to take out the regulator i guess.... any words of wisdom on doing this from inside the beast??

#18 TheBus

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Posted 27 August 2011 - 05:41 PM

I have the same issue with my Bronco. The motor works fine, but both switches don't work at all. An easy way to drop the window is unbolt the two regulator arms from the bottom of the window. I think there was two bolts on each side.

My work-around was to run jumper wires from window motor harness to the rear-window dash switch harness. A male quick disconnect fitting (just a flat piece of metal with a wire crimp on the end) works perfect for sliding into the harness plugs. The top two slots in the harness plug are ignition positive and chassis ground. Then just switch the wires in the harness plug to roll the window up and down. I hope that helps to at least get the window up/down when you need to.
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#19 Bronco Kid!

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Posted 27 August 2011 - 06:22 PM

hey thanks!! every bit of knowlege helps. i got the regulator out, and found my problem.. the top of each regulator arm is rusted and the plastic square that fits into the bottom window track would not spin/pivet nothing. so i am going to try to pop them off some how with out breaking them and try to wire wheel the piss out of the arms and ball that the plastic squares go on.. otherwise a new regulator will be my only option :( and i dont want to think how much thats going to cost! haha i should just get a new tailgate.

#20 Bronco Kid!

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Posted 27 August 2011 - 09:15 PM

well fixed the regulator and re installed everything now the window will go up and down by jumping the motor but not with either one of the switches.. this is weird because before i pulled everything apart the switches worked but the regulator was messed up.. just dont get it how does this happen!! lol hope its a bad conection at the plug will get a light tester tomorrow.. otherwise i dunno what i will do. NOTE TO SELF dont let bronco sit for 7 years with out moving everything ever again!!



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