1990 starting problem

1st post. New to forum even though this is my 3rd full size bronco.

Long story short: teaching son about Broncos while trading out tailgate on a newly acquired 1990 5.8 with E4OD. Battery was connected backwards (should have checked after his work, but it's a battery By The Gods! How do you ***** that up?).

Fried the solenoid and burned out the fuselink to the alternator. Replaced both.

Betty Blue wants start, she tries really hard to. She cranks hard, sound like she's gonna catch, then nothing.

Other than completely frying the ECM, what else am I missing? For starters, the fuel pump won't shut off and there is a very heavy smell of gas after trying to start her. The primer just doesn't shut off after you turn the key. I figure I need to test/replace the Fuel pump relay tomorrow.

I would appreciate some helpful hints/suggestions about what to check next to help her run again. Can't really afford to tow her in as I'm in Fairbanks AK and it's extremely expensive here for something I hope as minor as this. She ran beautifully before the mishaps and I'd really like to not want to throttle my son over this with a simple fix.

Thanks for the support.

yo NM!

WELCOME!

Right!

If it stays running with the truck off, then most likely you have a bad fuel pump relay; or da EEC Relay is hanging closed;

If the EEC relay goes bad, it could be sending the signal to the fuel pump relay to turn the fuel pumps on; One easy test for this is: Without the key in ignition, bump the starter over with the starter relay using a screwdriver or jumper or a fancy remote start jumper/ with a momentary push button.

or if it isn't allowed to post-up here; see the pic of this in my site @ http://www.broncolinks.com/gallery_images/StarterRelayJumpinin92-96.JPG



If it is the EEC relay, the truck will start without the key in the ignition..."

Source: by sackman9975 (Scott), Redwagon & miesk5

also; Color Codes for Troubleshooting/Swapping to Bosch Style Relays

Source: by Steve83 (Steve, That dirty old truck) at http://www.supermotors.net/registry/media/507189

Bosch Overview, Schematics, etc.

Source: by Craig U at http://www.classictruckshop.com/clubs/earlyburbs/projects/bosch/relay.htm

EEC Relay is BROWN Connector, next to GREEN FP Relay Connector Under hood behind air cleaner assy Location pic in a 90 and all up to 91

Source: by Need4racin (The 90 Bronco, Dean) at http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/9307/temp90pics033ru4.jpg

yo,

I forgot to mention that I'm away and have to post piece-meal due to lap top batty probs.

next is to find a wiring diagram for the other Fusible Links in your year

; such as this one http://fordfuelinjection.com/files/bronco_1989_40.gif

It shows N off of EEC Relay for an 89

& D in http://fordfuelinjection.com/files/bronco_1989_28.gif

Location in Wiring Diagrams in Electrical and Vacuum Troubleshooting Manual (EVTM) Partial, (Bronco similar for many diagrams), F 150 for 86, 89, 91 & 95; EEC, Start/Ignition, EFI/Fuel System, Emissions, E4OD, AOD/C6 (+ clutch interlock switch), etc.

Source: by Ford via Ryan M (Fireguy50) at fordfuelinjection.com

Thanks for the response. it gives me a little hope and a direction to start. Now if I can just get off these 24 hour rotations long enough to do some investigating.

Thanks again.

All other with an an idea please throw it at me.

Betty Blue cranked, caught then died. But she ran. Here's what I've done so far.

Replaced the Fuel Pump Relay. Even though the old one tested good, it was cracked so I said what they hey. This did not help as the fuel pump is still priming constantly while using the key.

Though trying something else i was told I floored it to see if that would put the ECU in flood clearing mode and she turned right over. As long as I fluttered the pedal she would stay started. this whole time I could still here the fuel pump primer going strong.

The reason I replaced the Fuel Pump Relay was because I was getting a new, correct sized battery (the old one was to small and held in by a strap). Something had drained the battery overnight when I left it hooked up. So I got new colored battery cables and the right sized 65 series from O'rielly's (either them, NAPA or Walmart here in Fairbanks AK) to try cranking her with the new relay.

Still need help here. The only thing that I can think of that could drain the battery is the alternator or the after market car alarm (that I swear I'm tearing out as soon as I get time).

Could the alternator have fried (that is also the fuselink that burned out that I already replaced)?

Is there a reset for the fuel pump that I'm not aware of?

Anything to help would be appreciated. I'd rather rebuild the transmission than mess with electrical stuff.

I did try bumping the starter to see if she would run, but it wouldn't. Of course, this was after I probably already flooded it so I'm gonna try again later.

Just an update.

She will not run by trying to bypass the ECU/ECC. Just cranks but won't fire up.

Bump. Still looking for ideas on the battery drain and resetting the fuel pump.

Thanks.

There is no reset for the fuel pump. check the codes. The fuel pump is supposed to run all the time IF the engine is running or you are cranking the engine,otherwise it should run for only 3-5 seconds each time you turn key to the run position. On my 90 the fuel pump ran all the time and it was nearly imposiable to start IF it did start it had absolutely no power it would not even move. When I tried to pull the DTCs it would not do anything. After exhaustive checking I replaced the ECM and it fired up on first try and is running great now. I was told that if it will not go into the selftest mode then the ECM is the problem turned out they were right.

new developments. Went and hooked up the new battery, started Betty Blue and paid a little more atention to what was going on.

Once i turn the key she'll start with just the lightest touch to the gas and as long as I feed her just a litle she runs fine. When she's running the CEL even goes off. The minute I stop feeding her she stalls out. There is the incredibly strong smell of gas and the whole time she is running the fuel pump still puts out that audible whine as if it is still priming. Even after she stalls the fuel pump doesn't quit.

So this time I leave the battery connected and plug on the scanner. The minute the scanner initiates the test and I hear the audible clicks of the testing right around the ignition coil and the fuel pump shuts off and the CEL goes out. I get the scan code 98 (KOEO) which I think means PCM (Powertrain Contol Module) failure in progress.

Now I have to ask ***? Ran it 3 different times this afternoon and came up with the same code. I still think I'm gettign a power drain on the battery, but it's hard to tell if the alt is recharging as I can't really let her idle (she's also in the garage and the smell of gas gets pretty bad). I'll pull it hopefully tomorrow or Friday and get it tested.

Any ideas before I jump off the deep end and order a new ECM? I'd rather an $80 fix than a $200.

Thanks.

yo,

Just saw I was still logged in here; I thought I logged off so wasn't around and igging ya

DTC 98 Hard fault present; "...FMEM is an alternate system strategy in the PCM that maintains vehicle operation if one or more sensor inputs fail.

When a sensor input is perceived to be out-of-limits by the PCM, an alternative strategy will be initiated.

The PCM will substitute a fixed in-limit sensor value and continue to monitor the faulty sensor input. If the faulty sensor operates within limits, the PCM will return to the normal engine running strategy.

The Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL)/Message will remain on when FMEM is in effect.

The MIL will come on while the engine is operating in Failure Mode Effects Management (FMEM) or Hardware Limited Operation Strategy (HLOS) modes. The light will stay on for at least 10 seconds, then stay on as long as the fault causing it is present. If the MIL flashes quickly (less than 10 seconds), the MIL circuit should be checked for concerns. Refer to «Quick Test».

In FMEM mode, the PCM is receiving a sensor signal that is outside the limits set by the calibration strategy. In this mode, the PCM uses an alternate engine control strategy to maintain reasonable vehicle operation in spite of the fault. The DTC associated with this fault is stored in Keep Alive Memory (KAM). If the fault is no longer present, the light will turn off and the vehicle will return to the normal vehicle strategy. The DTC stored when the light was on is kept in Continuous Memory for the next 80 warm-up cycles (40 cycles on some applications) and then erased. This Continuous Memory DTC can be accessed by running the Key On Engine Off Self-Test..."

Source: by miesk5 at Ford Bronco Zone Forums

I am thinking you ran the KOER portion when this code came up?

If so,

Re-run KOEO portion.. should have some code(s) come up that will help narrow this down

If in KOEO when that 98 came in, then da EEC will not allow a KOER to be run until the hard code failure is corrected

Again, If it is the EEC relay, the truck will start without the key in the ignition & Fuel Pump will start and keep running.

Operational Sequence; "...The computer turns on the fuel pump relay 1. For about 2 seconds when you first turn the key to ON and 2. when it senses rotation in the dizzy from the pickup. You should test your relays by applying 12 V across the small terminals, listen for the click and check continuity across the large terminals. This will rule out the relays themselves being a problem. Usually they ARE the problem, so hopefully you can stop there. They absolutely HATE moisture

The pickup in the distributor can throw a code when it is intermittent or not working. ..."

Source: by kf4amu (Will H, The Beast)

Pump Runs w/Ignition Switch Off; "...If it stays running with the truck off, then most likely you have a bad fuel pump relay; EEC Relay hanging closed; If the EEC relay goes bad, it could be sending the signal to the fuel pump relay to turn the fuel pumps on; One easy test for this is: Without the key in ignition, bump the starter over with the starter relay using a screwdriver. If it is the EEC relay, the truck will start without the key in the ignition..."

Source: by sackman9975 (Scott), Redwagon & miesk5

Talked to Mech down at Ramey Ford (johnson City TN: hometown) and he confirmed that a 98 KOEO code means the processor was fried. Hopefully gonna get around to pulling the ECM this evening so I can hit the one junkyard up here or just order from oriellys/NAPA. Should be around $160 but thats because of the location.

I'll keep posting till its fixed.

yo,

ok, but that DTC 98 info came str8 out of a Ford Bronco EVTM.

Can you try the KOEO test again?

EDIT; just SpAllAng

SCanned it twice again at lunch. The only code pulled is the 98. I'm not able to run the KOER as Betty Blue can't idle.

What I though was weird was that the test caused the pump to stop and cacelled the CEL every time I ran it.

I couldn't find an ECU at the salvage yard so I had to bite the bullet and order one through Oriellys. It'll be tuesday before it's freighted up from Seattle. I hate Alaska.

Just to finish off the topic.

ECU was the problem. oreillys got it in on Sat 28th, but since I was on 24 hour duty I didn't get a chance to pick it up and put it on until today.

She started right up, no fuss what so ever. Wish i had ordered the ECU earlier, but I'd rather a $12 fuse to a $99 (military discount) ECU.

Thank everybody for thier advice. I'm sure I'll be back soon as this Bronco is in rougher shape than either of my previous ones so I've got plenty to fix.

As a note I did get the other door gutted and installed (was making a good one out of two) today as well. Now for winterizing and tires and rims.

yo,

Good!

I too, wanted to see somethAng cheap & available as well as ... but you did well on the EEC.

as always,

THANKS FOR SERVING!!!